New BW EFR Turbo Thread
Speed on the straight is a small part of the equation, maybe with a small turbocharger SSE would have made a better time...The 9180 is a MASSIVE turbo, something like a Garrett GT42! Also, the SSE evo this year is very light, they shaved 800 lbs out in comparison to 2010 WTAC!
you can be sure that will happen once the turbos resume shipping over the next few weeks
l8r)
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From: KL,Malaysia
Speed on the straight is a small part of the equation, maybe with a small turbocharger SSE would have made a better time...
The 9180 is a MASSIVE turbo, something like a Garrett GT42!
Also, the SSE evo this year is very light, they shaved 800 lbs out in comparison to 2010 WTAC!
The 9180 is a MASSIVE turbo, something like a Garrett GT42!
Also, the SSE evo this year is very light, they shaved 800 lbs out in comparison to 2010 WTAC!
My tuner just did one that made 686kwatw (920whp) @ 28psi boost with twin low mount 3071's... Simply amazing
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From: Welly NZ
A chap down south has had a twin scroll EFR8374 on order for months which I believe will be going on an RB30, look forward to seeing how that goes... should have insane torque!
I can send you some graphs if you want, flick me a PM if you're keen.
It wasn't running full E85. He's using 50litres of E10, and 10litres of E85.
With Carls porting, smaller cams and that mixture of fuel, it picked up 140kwatw with 1psi less boost, and spooled about 300-400rpm faster... Absolutely sick
It's still lifting the head though, and he's running H11/L19 studs.
Geoff, what do you expect the 9180 to make on a average built 2.0? I know BW claims 1000hp and its running a 91mm compressor wheel (exducer I'm guessing) vs the GT42R 102mm and very similar sized turbine wheels.
I know EFR's are supposed to be made to work in higher boost ranges so what kinda boost you think this thing is really going to shine at because 32 psi is still pretty decent amount and only making a low 540whp MD on e85, that's not that much better then a FP red. Not saying it was max tune on 32 psi but everyone really wants these to shine like BW and you guys said they would.
We might as well forget the results of a race team like SSE because they have nothing in common with the average or even semi extreme evo owner.
Lets see a dyno graph of that 540whp already anyway.
I know EFR's are supposed to be made to work in higher boost ranges so what kinda boost you think this thing is really going to shine at because 32 psi is still pretty decent amount and only making a low 540whp MD on e85, that's not that much better then a FP red. Not saying it was max tune on 32 psi but everyone really wants these to shine like BW and you guys said they would.
We might as well forget the results of a race team like SSE because they have nothing in common with the average or even semi extreme evo owner.
Lets see a dyno graph of that 540whp already anyway.
I what regards?
The compressor exducer is 92.2mm compared to 94mm on the GT4294R. BW seems to measure backplate diameter and not tip diameter, it could easily be 94mm on the exducer with the extended tips?
It looks to be rated at 95 lb/min which puts it a hair under the 56-trim GTX4294R. I wonder how it compares to the 52-trim GTX4294R on flow capacity and pressure ratio as they both have 67mm inducers. Turbine side, same story 80mm on the EFR and 82mm on the GT42. Overall, it seems the EFR9180 is marginally smaller then the GTX4294R?
What is "incredibly early" spool for this turbo?
Looks like ~5300RPM for peak boost on the 2.2L from the dyno chart posted? Definitely good spool, but a friends 2.2L GT4 Celica with a GT4294R setup isn't too far behind that on a Dynojet at 4200' as it passes 600 ft-lbs by 5400 RPM. (Not to mentioned made 860 WHP at 34 psi...)
Twinscroll FTMFW...
On big heavy high HP turbo setups...
I'm not against these things by any means, I'm just not seeing anything earth shattering so far on dyno numbers. Other then that Cobalt, but those numbers just seem to be TOO GOOD to be believable. If others back those kind of power and spool numbers up on the 6758, I'm sold.
Shows promise, but the GT2871R turbochargers seem extremely laggy on a lot of the setups I've seen. Usually 4000+ RPM for full boost on a 2.0L. Seems like a badly matched turbo to start with? It also seems like the GT2871R does nothing but add (A LOT of) lag and lose torque to the GT2860RS until the 350+ HP range.
Last edited by 03whitegsr; Aug 11, 2011 at 09:27 PM.
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Just read through this thread - some interesting opinions for sure!
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
Just read through this thread - some interesting opinions for sure!
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
-Eric
hey patrick - good speaking with you today. 32.6psi is the maximum inteneded boost level for the single port internal wastegate canister. Sean is obviously on the right track that adding a 2nd barb to the canister is the correct thing to do (in principle) *however* it will be tough to do this to the existing canister without damaging the diaphragm and/or having a boost leak at the bottom of the can. As I mentioned we will have the billet EFR wastegate actuators with dual nipples ready shortly and this will be a great test bed for them. I look forwards to finding out what you guys figure out 
I personally can't wait to see what this and the 9180 turbos do in full tilt mode!
FWIW on our MD a car making 550 HP in close to full weight will trap 135-140 mph
And that is more than often with higher boost pressures closer to 40psi
If this turbos stays on the car we have a couple of different options to help hold boost better up top we have been in contact with Geoff and will hopefully have some more #'s soon.
I was busy getting my car prep'd for some new mods yesterday and i'm not 100% that our tuner would like the prelim. graph out but i will do my best to get it up here but it's by no means close to being tuned at 100%
