the moderators can only do so much.if you **** off the vendors then?????????? got to let them post what they want or else.sad but true.

 

This could have been all but stopped a long time ago if Shiv would have lost his account just like Al did... Esp. since he has continued to act in the same manner, causing the same ****. No kudos to Al, but if you look from aback, you will find that Al was provoked by Shiv much of the time out of nowhere. Now that's not to say that Al shouldn't have had the maturity not to "bite". Bet your *** Shiv would all but disappear if his "business" was no longer financing the board. That is about the only thing that would come close to saving the integrity of this board. It looks like there needs to be a "boot trouble maker Shiv" poll. This is coming from an older fellow who can step back and look at the situation from a distance. I've voiced the fact that I didn't like piggybacks and high prices, but it was much later that I came to have a distaste for the intelligent trouble maker.

 

And yet it all stays. I particularly like how Shiv and his faithful have taken over this thread and started the Al bashing again. It's like they can't help themselves. The worst part is that mods have posted in the thread just to say It's too much work to clean it up so it why bother. Never should have gone this far in the first place boys. This forum is really going down the toilet fast. During the summer, someone posted a poll about the age of Evo owners here. I was really surprised to see so many owners in the 18-25 age range (more than half IIRC) with $30k cars. Now I believe it as that's how old the majority of the posters on this board act.

Mark, you do know that this forum has become the comic relief for many other forums, right? I find links to these threads all over the internet.

Someone already said it, we are (mostly) all adults here. I can make up my mind as to who's stuff I'm going to spend my money on. If I was Shiv, I'd be pm'ing these guys and asking them to knock it off; they are hurting his business. There is mis-information in every marketing medium; buyer beware.

 

mr.zeus you are so rite al did brag on his stuff but if you look at his braging was just exitment.no harm ment.my2c

 

This forum is a joke you either have the RnR virus infecting any thread no matter what the topic is with BUY MY ****. Then you have **** i mean shiv posting his arrogant im better then you babble. Or you have Dave here having to defend himself in every ****ing post.

Because the over flow of clueless evo driving retards buy in to ****'s i mean shiv's anti everything bull****.
Time for a new evo forum where venders cant uses ever line as a sales pitch and over run every thread with bull****.


Stay TOONED relief is on the way

 

IT's already here. try it www.evohorsepower.com

 

I would disagree with that. Specifically, Al implies that Works is overcharging for their flashes through one of his aliases, one their products which he has purchased before and has stated to be great. Later on down the road, when he gets his flash going, he says they are crap. It was only after talking to someone at Works via the phone that he apologizes and states that he was sick at the time.

Excitement, eh?

This entire pissing match is about mindshare and marketshare. It all comes down to bragging rights and moreover, money at the end.

After seeing everything unfold on this forum the way it has over the past few months, I think it is rather easy to decide who you should spend your hard earned money with.

 

You know, you're right. There is only so much a moderator can do. And I imagine that the mods on this site are paid nothing or next to nothing for their time.

This kind of crap has gone on for years on Usenet forums and mailing lists. The "pure" newsgroups and mailing lists are moderator run. In other words, no posts are public until a mod can approve or reject a post. Granted this gives a moderator a great deal of editorial privilege but it keeps the information clean. Perhaps some pure moderated forums need to be created here.

 

**** Mods feel free to give me a warning point for this but I feel it needs to be said****

Al, Shiv and Dave, you are all retards and I will explain why:

Al- you have a great product on you hands. You also have a lot of happy costumers such as myself but instead of doing your thing and making more money, you decided to keep playing shove with Shiv and see where it got you. Like I have told you on the phone, all you have to do is just do your thing and ignore all the other and you will be all set. Every time you get into a fight with Shiv you only discredit your product and make yourself appear like a whiny kid.

Shiv- I have seen your products and used them for the past 2 years on my WRX. They are truly work of art and I truly believe that you are one of the best out there. I really don?t see why you need to keep trying to prove something even though you have many happy and loyal costumers who can attest to your knowledge and high quality products. All you do by fighting with Al is to credit him and empower him and make yourself appear very unprofessional. Also, keep in mind that all the people that post for you and try to protect your name do way more harm than good and are actually causing you to lose more costumers.

Dave- you are the best when it comes to the 4g63, no doubt about that. I have seen your products many times and they are truly great and they do get the power. The main reason why I was so happy to use your products was due to the fact that you are a man of actions and not words. You let the numbers and times do the talking for you and can back up and claim you make which is truly an amazing quality. When you involve yourself in fights such as this, you make yourself no better than the guy you are fighting with and discredit yourself. All you have to do is just keep doing what you have been doing for the past 15 years and you will be all set.


All 3 of you- you are truly a great bunch of kids. For the past few months you have managed to annoy and **** off so many people on this board. I am sad to say that due to your recent immature behavior, I have decided not to use any of you for my car or my costumer?s cars and I know I am not alone in this decision. Take it as you wish but I feel that something needs to be done and fast.

the thing that really make me laugh is the fact that all of your products are designed for different people with different goals and yet you feel the need to bust each other's ***** all the time. one is selling reflash for the guy that would like to do all the mods at once and get it over with while the other sells piggyback for the DIY type of guy.

?Arguing on the net is like running in the special Olympics, even if you win you are still a retard?

 

i know dave personaly tym and dan as well.the only reason they are geting pissed.is becuse they are trying to mess with there reputation.they got a good one.they have work hard for it.and dont want to see it messed up over some one talking crap.my2c

 

I'm wondering why this thread is different than what I've seen on this board in the past?
I mostly just read this site and evaluate info for when I do get an EVO VIII, but I know the 4G63.

I've seen entire threads on this site where Shiv wouldn't answer direct questions about his product and his own stupid comments get "cleansed" by moderators or the like. At that time I presumed that this site protected it's sponsors in a very bad way.

In this thread, Shiv clearly started the **** talking in his very first post, then the Shiv sheep jumped in.

The current dilemma is that should this thread be "cleansed" now, it will be perceived as this site protecting Shiv once again. That has got to stop.

Dave simply posted up results as compared to other shop's results. It seems that Shiv felt singled out and inferior, so he responded. Bad idea that was and he successfully turned this thread into a **** festival. Close it please, but leave the info, for those that can actually read, to see.

As for the numbers? As long as the same method is used before and after a modification, no matter what dyno it is, the gains and the curve are the story. Maybe Dave should've just posted the chart itself. That would've been great for some of us as we would've compared for ourselves then made the phone call to inquire and then congratulate, hehe. I wonder what Shiv would've posted then?

As far as the Al stuff, the $$ based business decision makes perfect sense to me and then Buschur even answered the why about it. I've seen less of other vendors on this site and they get away with it.

I see questions in this thread that were answered completely after the **** started flying, then Shiv only started posting links to defame Al. Classy that was. What is the motive there?

Again mods, Close it please, but leave all of the info, for those that can actually read, to see.

 

Its great there is a forum for the EVO. Having owned more than 9 DSM's since 1990 and now a new EVO. But am dissapointed in all of the comments and remarks on this board. The component holding back the new EVO seems to be the ECU. And now BR has the flash program option, which should be commended. Affordable too!!! Lot less than buying an AEM and trying to keep it tuned. With the older DSM's, the computers were much more forgiving with better timing and fuel tables. ECU's weren't a big deal on the road to making a fast 4G63. Not so easy today.
Its sad there are so many armchair mechanics and experts behind a keyboard. Instead of sharing and learning, everything seems to be a he said, she said endless circle. But then again, seems to be the only way some companies can defend their programming services which are twice the price of the BR flash.
More than one way to skin a cat when it comes to mods, guess the savvy and intelligent look at the facts and spend their hard earned dollar where it gets the most bang for the buck. I know I sure am, and BR looks to be the benifactor.

 

God I hate to do this.
This quote I have in my wallet from a good friend.
" Never argue with an Idiot, He will bring you down to his level and beat you with experience"
Some have even said that here on this forum. For a while now I have tried to give many vendors the benefit of the doubt. I have heard alot of BS and alot of good points.
But this was un called for Shiv.
I would not and dont like saying this but it is just rediculous. There is no reason for ANYONE other than potential customers to respond to this thread. David started this to give an update on new products. He was excited and I dont blame him. I am glad they have such dedication to our cars. Just like we do. Not that others dont, but from what I have seen recently "others" are only in it for the money rather than the passion we call "fruits of our labor". Mr Buschur doesn't remember me but In the past we met on several occasions here in Jersey. I have used his poducts for years for myself and clients. The man has a passion for what he does. He enjoys it. He does **** right. I dont really want to go on too much because it is just taking up my time to comment on the reputation this man and his company has built thru the years. It already speaks for itself. Shiv, I have come to the conclusion that you have a horrible inferiority complex. Just chill and everyone else to.
Z1, Very good post. Good to see more vendors here with a good head on their shoulders
Dave and Tym, Great job and good luck in the future.
My 2 1/2 cents

 

IMO, I saw Shiv showing similar types of post that he accussed Al of bringing forth previously, and therefore had a hand in having Dynoflash banned. IMO, Shiv deserves something similar to what Dynoflash received. Going around in another tuner's post, bashing him, and taking things personal, even when the original poster had not even made any direct references shows that Shiv is not contributing anything positive, something that Al/Dynoflash was bashed for so many times in the past.

I have no doubt that you had a hand in having Al banned. And IMO, that just goes to show your character, and integrity.

Props to the Buscher Team and Al. I know which route I will be taking my EVO. Then Id like to hit up the 1/4 track, and road courses, and spank up some V-I-S-H-N-U tuned cars.

Btw Vishnu, nice hp curve on your dyno. <----------notice the wink lol.

 

Boy I better go get my popcorn this is getting good why not just lock this thread already?