I believe they are mixing E85 with 100 octane i know very little of the specifics, but some of those guys find every inch to get any advantage possible.

 

If E85 is equivalent to 105 octane why would anyone mix it with 100 octane? To make it easier to use w/ the stock fuel system?

I would think at that point it would be easier just to use race gas...

 

dyno jet. boost control and boost limit arent the same.

might have been.

Spirit of the rules and actual cheating are 2 different things. That which is not strictly forbidden is permitted. Gray areas are how you win. Running stock injectors on E85 and high boost is possible since other systems are open there to manipulate.

 

I just want to understand this -

You're talking about "boost cut load" and "boost cut delay" in ECUFlash, right?

And that only matters if you add manually adjust the wastegate preload?

I think both the spirit and the letter are pretty clear on this. Even if you don't think those particular ECU values constitute electronic boost control, I don't see how adjusting the WGA is anything but mechanical boost control. But you know the ECU much better than I do, so maybe I am missing something here...

 

Unless it changed for 2012, the last team I consulted for (2011) the rules did not disallow it. An O2 housing that causes boost creep is altering boost control. Its a matter of semantics at that point think. The only software in the system that is labelled boost control is the WGDC (wastegate duty cycle) and BLD (boost desired load). The hardware has a Boost control solenoid (BCS). I can leave the boost cut/boost cut delay stock and not ever hit it if I dont want to, thats a matter of mapping.

I get paid to find loopholes and gray areas...sometimes even grey areas. Its the 10/80/10 rule which applies to lots of things in the world, but racing just as much.

10% straight do it wrong
80% do it like everyone else
10% win

I am not here for controversy, so I apologise if I ruffled any feathers.

 

From the 2011 Solo rules, section 14.10.F:

The waste gate actuator is a boost control, so tweaking it is definitely not allowed. I can't really interpret this section any other way. It goes on to say:

So whether or not you consider the O2 housing a boost control doesn't matter, because it's explicitly allowed to change the O2 housing. This also clarifies that mechanically tweaking your WGA is illegal.

Section 14.10.F.1:

Raising the boost cut limit in the ECU does alter the boost levels in a car with a modified waste gate exhaust outlet . But as I understand it, it doesn't actually interface with the boost controls hardware. Instead, it just changes (cuts?) fueling. I could be totally wrong here, but that was my understanding of how that function works. Since we're allowed to change fueling, and this is actually a fueling control as opposed to a boost control, then I suppose boost cut limit changes are allowed? Gray area for sure, but that's how I read it.

Of course, if the boost cut actually does interface with the boost control hardware somehow, then I'd say that it's clearly not allowed.

 

I think Grassroots Motorsports made a pretty good argument that the winners are playing by the rules (Maybe not in NASCAR, but that's "racing" like the WWE is "wrestling").

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/art...os-vs-schmoes/

I think I'm kinda like one of the midpack guys in the article. My alignment, ECU tune, and driving skill are all leaving something on the table. The ECU tune is the easiest thing to fix right now. I don't know who to go to for an alignment in the Florida panhandle. My driving? The fix for that is on course, not on the forum. :-)

I think a restrictive O2 housing isn't much of a gray area. It's an exhaust part that you're allowed to change. The rules allow for things which indirectly affect the engine, i.e. things that allow the car to reach the boost limits more easily, but don't actually raise the limit.

It doesn't surprise me to hear that some competitors are knowingly inducing boost spikes. They must be willing to spend a lot of money on repairs when the boost spikes finally take their toll on the engine.

Edit: I found a guy in the Wiregrass Region SCCA who did a pretty good alignment on my car. Now that I'm back in NC, I can get alignments done by a friend in my home town. I think my ECU is misbehaving, and could use a reset, but after a few years of abuse, now the clutch is the limiting factor...

Edit #2: Got my clutch replaced. Now, about that driving skill...

 

That's a nice piece, and yes that's exactly what we're talking about.

Like I said, the wastegate obstruction method is not for the faint of heart. I haven't tried it, but I imagine it requires a bit of tweaking to get the obstruction size 'just right'. Think of it like having a really bad manual boost controller, except you have to dismantle your exhaust and start cutting/welding things whenever you want to make a boost change.

A while back I had an idea to make the adjustments easier on a tubular, divorced-wastegate pipe like yours, though. My plan was to cut a hole in the wastegate pipe and weld a wide nut into it. I would then run a long bolt through the nut and into the exhaust stream. A jam nut would hold it in place. From there, I imagined I could tweak the obstruction by varying the depth of the bolt.

But for the Evo IX, the MAP divorced tubular wastegate O2/downpipe combo was 4x the price of my cheap eBay O2 + second-hand downpipe combo, so economics won out for now. I'd still like to see someone try this method though.

 

Construct quoted the rule that allows for smaller diameter WG exhaust size, Im not sure how much room you have with the X fuel system running E85 but an 8 or 9 will run stupid lean on the stock setup thus why they are mixing E85 with 100 octane as the 100 octane richens up the mixture.
Leaded fuel is not allowed in STU correct? So that would answer whomever asked about using straight race gas, there is a 104 or something that is unleaded too i believe, i dont care enough to find the cost or where to get it.

Is the evoX ECU fuel or boost cut... Because i thought it cut fuel not boost and therefore would be allowable to adjust.

 

Dredging up my old thread again...

I'm pretty close to buying the Tactrix plug and cable, and I was looking at a wideband O2 sensor on the Tactrix web site.

The description says: "The basic LC-1 kit includes the LC-1, sensor, cd which includes software and manuals, bung and plug, and a serial cable to connect to the PC."

Bung and plug? I thought the wideband sensor would go in place of the stock sensor.
Do I have to put a new bung somewhere on my exhaust to plug in the wideband sensor???

 

Yes. The stock O2 sensor stays where it is and the wideband typically is a little further down.

 

If the stock O2 sensor is still plugged in, how does the new one get plugged into the ECU?

(It gets plugged into the ECU somehow, right?)

 

In most cases, the wideband feeds a gauge, a logger (ex: Evoscan) or both. IIRC, there is some way to make the stock ECU use the wideband instead of the narrowband but I am not sure under what circumstances make sense.

In my case I was troubleshooting a lean condition and I just wanted to know what the heck was going on.

 

It sounds like the wideband O2 sensor isn't always necessary for doing a tune on your Evo. I'm tempted not to spend that money.

But, if I decide one day to get an e-mail tune, and the tuner needs to see logs, will he need wideband O2 data? Or, are they usually OK with data from the standard sensor?

 

If you're at a shop, they'll have a tailpipe O2 most likely.

But yeah, if you are doing an email tune, you'll want the wideband.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ec...-tune-evo.html
Obviously, your trusted tuner is the final word here