Firstly I'd like to thank Bryan for the test & data, it is what we have been waiting to see.

Well I guess I'm not the only who was shocked with this particular test. I had to go back over the dyno sheets to make sure I hadn't got the 2 mixed up. I thought that the outcome would've shown the power/torque curves in favour of the White.

I would've liked to see some baseline runs done before the White was put on, as a few others have said also. I ;however, think that the test comparison was done very professionally & openly with no bias.

Let's hope that some others that are tuned & tested show better results on similarly modified IX's. Don't write these off to quickly....Time will tell.

Steve

 

i saw this coming from a mile away.

 

According to that info the white doesn't seem like an upgrade....

 

FP White seems more like a downgrade to me... an expensive one. The only thing I can hope for is that the weather conditions caused the numbers to fluctuate more than they should. A same day comparison may shed more light.

 

Razorlab, thank you for the honest test info,

all the people that frequent the ecuflash forum know that you are a good tuner


to everyone saying that this turbo is not being run in its efficiency or not in optimum boost or at different weather conditions or .......................

It should not be that hard to get a gain out of a turbo upgrade in the first place, it should be able to make a noticeable difference relatively easliy an not need all the planets and stars and mosquitoes aligned for it to make an extra 5 whp

this is only one car, lets wait to see how it does on another

 

The responses in here would make a tuner not want to post results about certain parts because they are immediately being questioned about their tuning abilities.

I am a big fan of Buschur and love David's honesty and commitment to our community but 9sec9 never tested the stock ix on his car and why should he have. He isn't interested in it. He is here to set records and to go as fast as possible. The stock turbo won't get him to where he wants to be so why bother with it. We know what Lucas English produced 502, I know different dynos and all, and ran 126 traps on his stock ix turbo. Then CWill from AWD ran a 10.987 at 126 also, with a stock block and ecu and e85.

David B said his brother dyno'ed at 374 on 93 octane with drop in pistons, I believe, which isn't bad. The FP red dynoed at 406 at 28 psi with a built engine on Trent's car with straight 93 octane and has gone 10.9's. That is 32 extra hp with a built engine and a better flowing turbo. The FP red flows better than the white but no one has tested the white on straight pump gas.

I hope more tests come out just like this and I hope the white does well, it shows that it out flows the stock turbo after 6k. You will have to determine if it is enough for your needs or just go with a green or red.

I could be wrong with the dyno numbers and such but this is what I can recall. This is a great test and I don't believe it is hurting FP's business. 90% of the people on this thread will never push a turbo to it maximum capabilities like Buschur and 9sec9.

Great data razorlab.

 

which is which?

One of you please explain to me how you can log more airflow, use more fuel , and show less power.

 

I have plenty of confidence that Bryan is tuning this car as well as he tunes his own car. Bryan, when I asked the customer on the phone yesterday who was flashing his ECU it was because 60-70% of the time the guy will say "my brother has a friend that does it", if you dont ask, then you dont find out. I hope you didn't get your feeling hurt because of a couple simple questions.

I didnt get the customers name yesterday, but he never emailed me the datalogs, mivec maps, and bin files from his car last night like he said he would. I told him I would review them and try to help him get more out of his setup, I do remember him asking me if I thought his GSC S1 cams were large enough. Anyway, instead of getting logs to go over to help the guy, I found this thread.

BOOST ON!

Robert Young

 

Razorlab.

This was a very effective test. This produced results for the 'average joe' who wants more power from a bolt-on application. The 'average joe' is also ALWAYS looking for the best 'bang for the buck'. I'm sure in certain conditions (35+psi, racegas or meth) the white can stretch its legs and show an improvement, but was the improvement cost effective?

For an evo 8 owner, it's cost effective to spend $450 on a used ix turbo to pick up some top-end.

For a ix owner it's cost effective to go with a green.

In my opinion its cost effective to just go hard or go home and buy an HTA35r and just call it a day, but for the guys needing the stealth it seems that the FPred will be the most intelligent choice.

FP is it's own greatest competitor. They have done a fantastic job of turbo options, but as consumers we are constantly raising the bar, always wanting more.

The results from this test conclude that the average bolt-on, pumpgas evo won't see huge gains from the white. The areas where the turbo shines are too far out of the box. The same car on a green or red will not only see the results the are looking for on the dyno, but it will be a real world seat of the pants increase-- every evo-owner has their own 'butt-dyno'.

Buschur cars are Perfect. Almost too perfect for for the average joe to relate to. On average, i've seen DB extract almost 100awhp from everyone else in the industry on the same turbo application. His cars are prime examples of what the limits are on products. His combinations and tuning ability continue to set the bar year after year. For the rest of us 'sheep' in the world with stock motors, stock head, stock intake manni, blah,blah,blah-- sometimes we just need the LEAST modified car as possible to realte to. These 2 ends of the spectrum gives us the paremeters to make decisions.


Looking forward to the results on the FPred.

Just my .02.

 

You guys shouldn't be so quick to write off this turbo... give it a chance. I am sure there will be a few more cars, and at that point you can make a determination (as long as the testing was done right)

 

This is a perfect example of blaming a turbo for a flat tire, because you bolted the turbo on yesterday.

The focus shouldn't be on that it made less power, but that it made less power WHILE FLOWING MORE AIR AND USING MORE FUEL. Those two items are mutually exclusive taken by themselves as far as an engine is concerned, so there must be one or more other conditions that produced the result. Turbo did its job, something else effected the outcome. The ECU and engine doesn't care what turbo is on it.

Besides, the operating areas where this car was run are in the minor improvement areas, it ain't been near where the significant differences are, and nobody here has claimed otherwise. I said it before and I'll say it again, 1580 is a rockin' little unit within its operating parameters, hard to improve on, but higher PR and higher RPM areas can and have had significant improvements. If you're stuck with 91 octane pump gas you have a long hard struggle trying to make more power with anything.

Oh, also look at boost threshold- is it any different than the 1580?

 

I believe it did make more power - from 6k upwards, 5-10whp according to razorlab's ast post.


This is just one test, more to come I'm sure.

 

Thank you for the data Razorlab

Thank you for explaining to the people that are rushing to conclusions CO_VR4

I'm really not sure what people were expecting out of this turbo, but the probably have not looked at green comparisons to the stock IX turbo. Patiently awaiting the red results.

 

I was expecting to see quicker spool (full boost onset at a lower rpm). Were you trying to tune for this, Bryan, or just trying to keep the boost curves identical?

Quicker spool is one of the most attractive things about this turbo I think.

Also EE and GrocMax know what's up. I think the following rhetorical question may relate to this situation...

"I just went from 91 octane to 100 octane on my car with no changes to my tune. Why didn't I gain any power?"

 

I just don't understand how there can be pages of pages of hype, and 9sec9 writing his descriptive post saying how responsive and great the turbo was, when in all the time, neither FP or Buschur did a back to back test.

It's like jeez guys, in the time it took you to post all this stuff on the white, you could have bolted on a 9 turbo and re-dyno'd the car couln't you?

Since FP and Buschur make money selling these turbos, and since it seems simple enought to spend an hour bolting a 9 turbo back on a particular setup, it seems the responsible thing to do in my opinion before you sell it.