The Turbokit is out and it's sick
Evolving Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 204
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From: Tucson
I dunno, it seems like there is no such thing as a “perfect” turbo kit. I like AMS and I really like their solutions, but I've seen too many tubular manifolds (or headers if you prefer) crack after a few years, so I just can't trust them.
With these small displacement engines it seem you either have to go for lots of power with lots of lag, or little lag with little power. Just moving from the Eclipse line where full boost was available at 2500 RMP to the Evo where even moderate boost levels were moved 1000 rpm higher is a huge adjustment. There have been a couple times when I've made a right hand turn at a red light while the a/c was on, expecting to merge easily and ended up nearly getting rear ended while waiting 3 seconds before the boost even started to kick in. Moving the usable power another five hundred rpm further away just doesn't sound like a reasonable answer to me.
The only solution seems to be a twin turbo setup which is very expensive and is an extremely difficult setup to orchestrate properly. Not to mention the fact that there probably isn't even enough room to do it on the Evo. I'm starting to think everything is either too much or too little for this car. There doesn't seem to be a “baby bear” solution around.
EDIT: by “twin-turbo” I mean a sequential setup
With these small displacement engines it seem you either have to go for lots of power with lots of lag, or little lag with little power. Just moving from the Eclipse line where full boost was available at 2500 RMP to the Evo where even moderate boost levels were moved 1000 rpm higher is a huge adjustment. There have been a couple times when I've made a right hand turn at a red light while the a/c was on, expecting to merge easily and ended up nearly getting rear ended while waiting 3 seconds before the boost even started to kick in. Moving the usable power another five hundred rpm further away just doesn't sound like a reasonable answer to me.
The only solution seems to be a twin turbo setup which is very expensive and is an extremely difficult setup to orchestrate properly. Not to mention the fact that there probably isn't even enough room to do it on the Evo. I'm starting to think everything is either too much or too little for this car. There doesn't seem to be a “baby bear” solution around.
EDIT: by “twin-turbo” I mean a sequential setup
Last edited by Satori; Jun 20, 2004 at 10:47 AM.
Satori,
I know exactly what you mean. Most of my experience in the past has been with V-8 stuff. Turbos remind me of cam shafts. The higher duration seems to move the power up in the rpm range. In order to take advantage of the power and eliminate the lag, we had to switch to a steeper rear gear ratio. Unfortunately, the EVO has not got the capability to switch to a steeper gear ration...........but I would sure like to see it with a 3037 or 35 turbo with cams. launches would be insane and lag would be minimized with the larger turbos.
Ahhh....to dream
I know exactly what you mean. Most of my experience in the past has been with V-8 stuff. Turbos remind me of cam shafts. The higher duration seems to move the power up in the rpm range. In order to take advantage of the power and eliminate the lag, we had to switch to a steeper rear gear ratio. Unfortunately, the EVO has not got the capability to switch to a steeper gear ration...........but I would sure like to see it with a 3037 or 35 turbo with cams. launches would be insane and lag would be minimized with the larger turbos.
Ahhh....to dream
Evolved Member
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Joined: Mar 2003
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From: Danville/Blackhawk, California
Hi guys-- Here's my take on the ATP 3071, fwiw. It does indeed spool up just like the 3037 (also .63)/custom tubular manifold set up I had on our One Lap car. However, it does this with a *stock cat* and not the test pipe that I run. All things equal, I suspect it to have 700-8000rpm spool up advantage to the GT3037 which is really quite good. Also, on our dyno, boost lag tends to be exaggerated due to the way the engine loads up. Well, not really exaggerated... but it comes close to representing the boost lag you feel on the street when you load it up in 3rd gear. If tested with a much slower ramp-up rate (simulating the first 5 or so seconds of a Dynojet pull where the big rollers are slowly getting up to speed), boost response with drop by another 400-600rpm which is where I suspect ATP is getting their sloop up claims. As such, their claim is perfectly valid and the difference in spool up that we are seeing is based mostly on differences in testing methods. Nothing to create a controversy about, IMHO 
To give you an idea of how different loads and different gears can effect spool up, look at this: In 4th gear, lugging from a low RPM, the big GT35 on my car can reach 20psi by 4500rpm. In 3rd, it takes until just under 5000rpm. In 2nd, it takes until past 5500rpm. So spool up numbers, by themselves, don't explain the whole picture-- especially when dealing with bigger turbos.
And as others pointed out, we'd really love to get a car with cams, gears, test-pipe (or at least a high flow cat), full race gas to test this kit on. But so far, with this car, the results are quite good. We have established that putting a bigger turbo on an EVO without upgrading cams leaves a lot on the table as exhibited by the power roll-off above 6000rpm. Still, the car made plenty of power given the few mods
my 2c,
Shiv
To give you an idea of how different loads and different gears can effect spool up, look at this: In 4th gear, lugging from a low RPM, the big GT35 on my car can reach 20psi by 4500rpm. In 3rd, it takes until just under 5000rpm. In 2nd, it takes until past 5500rpm. So spool up numbers, by themselves, don't explain the whole picture-- especially when dealing with bigger turbos.And as others pointed out, we'd really love to get a car with cams, gears, test-pipe (or at least a high flow cat), full race gas to test this kit on. But so far, with this car, the results are quite good. We have established that putting a bigger turbo on an EVO without upgrading cams leaves a lot on the table as exhibited by the power roll-off above 6000rpm. Still, the car made plenty of power given the few mods
my 2c,
Shiv
Last edited by shiv@vishnu; Jun 20, 2004 at 11:49 AM.
Ok guys. I just got back home. I had to sleep somewhere in the middle of the night cuz I was very tired. I made with ATP turbo kit and 3" exhaust made by helix 100 extra whp on pump gas 91 alone. I drove the car all the way back home and I can say YES it lags about 700 to 800 later than our stock turbo but I have stock cat which sux. If I replace it which I will next week I will gain about 200 to 300 rpm better spool Which is about 100 rpm away from what ATP said. Bottom line I have sooooooooo much power it’s not even funny any more. with race gas or even 97 gas my car made about 145 whp on a dyno jet. This is amazing for a stock car. I made 235 whp on my stock car now I am making on a dyno jet any where between 335 and 345 which ATP said I would make. no one lied. Shiv was the best guy ever. He took his time and more to tune my car. I have never seen a tuner that can explain and help more. He gave me the best prices ever. With the best customer service
Just to let you guys know DynoD read about 15% to 18% lower than Dyno jet that means 296 whp on DD is = to 335 to 345 whp on dyno jet which what ATP promised. with me having a cat delete pipe i will be around 350 to 355 exactly what i wanted. just think about it this way I have so much power after 4000 rpm that I smoked a 911 turbo today on the way back from 80 miles role about 5 cars ahead. I mean for a turbo kit I am running now low 12 high 11s for $3000.
When I am on 4th gear and reping a 911 turbo @ 4000 rpm nothing feels better 
. the guy was so pissed of he passed me doing more than 150mph lol. I hear my turbo spool up so nice it has it's own tone that scare the **** out of me. if I want it to spool like stock all I have to do is get cat delete pip+ cam gear camshafts, nice as s turbo manifold and i will be spooling at 3500 or even lower thatn that. I do recommand buying this kit if you are planning to reach the 400 to 450 whp like I am. with vishnu flash of course.
. the guy was so pissed of he passed me doing more than 150mph lol. I hear my turbo spool up so nice it has it's own tone that scare the **** out of me. if I want it to spool like stock all I have to do is get cat delete pip+ cam gear camshafts, nice as s turbo manifold and i will be spooling at 3500 or even lower thatn that. I do recommand buying this kit if you are planning to reach the 400 to 450 whp like I am. with vishnu flash of course.
