my post was to show the dual purpose nature of the MR, not only is it a nice car to drive around town, it also performs respectable on the track.

about shifting gears... i think you're making a pretty big assumption as to whether or not mis-shifts are common. maybe for someone who doesn't know how to drive, but at willow springs on that particular MR that was not an issue.

Hypothetical bench racing between an MR & RS is really pointless. That MR was actually in competition, not computer racing as you're attemping to do now.

 

Your original post said NOTHING about the dual nature of the EVO. You simply typed the MR times vs. the other EVO times during the shootout. Now your revising what you said.

Mis-shifts are very common when racing. It happens. It happened to many Toyota Celica owners with their 6-speeds. Drivers make mistakes, but that does not mean that they do not know how to drive. When you have to shift too much you will make errors.

The MR maxes out its 4th gear at 105 mph. That means that you might shift into 5th gear on the front straights of Streets of Willow. In the RS you do not have to do that since 4th gear maxes out at 113 MPH. So you will be in 5th in the MR going into turn one and in 4th in the RS doing the same. Then after turn one you MUST shift from 5th to 4th to 3th and then to 2nd gear in the 05 MR to set up for the tight right hander of turn 2. In the 05 RS you shift from 4th to 3rd to 2nd to do the same. That extra shift WILL slow you down, ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL. I am assuming that the driver is not going to skip gears from 5th to 2nd or from 4th to 2nd.

I drove an STI that maxed out its 4th gear at 99 mph and it was damned annoying to downshift from 5th after turn one while late braking and setting up the car for turn 2.

While the EVO's were time trialing at Streets, I was next door at the big track doing actual door-to-door racing with TCRA. I won may class in both days. On Sat I won in spectacular fashion coming from last place after I spun my car while in 4th place on the 1st lap. I just do not want you to get the impression that I am a bench racer.

From my experience the 05 RS is a far better track car than the 05 MR. Unless you have a Sequential gear box, 6-speed is NOT an advantage on a road course. The MR has no advantage over an 05 RS on the TRACK and the RS is lighter and 7K cheaper to boot.

 

ey... first of all dont talk out of ur *** about the gear ratios and 6 speed... because like it or not ... evo does faster times than an rs at any track.. any day.. any where... who cares about shifting into 5th or 4th... by the time u get to the straight away an Mr will probably be way ahead of u... Better suspension.. from wat i read in motor trend ... the MR weight is 300 pounds lighter than the standard evo... and rs cant be that much lighter.. id like to see 2 pro drivers... one mr and one rs... i think MR would win 100% no matter wat... Dont compare the rs to mr... rs was made for people who want to make the car straight of drag racing car.. or all out tracks.. evo is to get u to work.. and back.. while spanking cars anywhere..anytime... hey its rainy here.. How do u keep urself warm in a rs? ********** while u drive?

 

it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the connections.

street car which drove over 300+ miles to the event + did respectable against more modified evos at the track = dual nature

although the mr and rs have the same powerplant, the mr has better gearing and therefore more acceleration.

i dont understand what the big deal with downshifting one extra gear is. you're DECELERATING. you can't walk and chew gum at the same time??? my driver loved the MR gear box. mishifting is not common amongst experienced race car drivers. sorry to break it to you. it's not like you're driving a 9 sec drag car where a fast shift means the difference between winning and losing.

TCRA? sorry never heard of it.

 

That is not what you said in your FIRST post. You simply listed the track times as if to suggest that the MR is a better track car. Well it is not a better track car than the 05 RS. The 05 RS is lighter and has the SAME ACD and front Helical LSD. So how in the hell can the MR be a better track. The 05 MR is better than the 03-04 EVOs, but it is NOT better than the 05 RS on the TRACK. The gearing is not that different 1 through 3.

MR
1st=40 mph
2nd=59 mph
3rd=80 mph

RS
1st=40 mph
2nd=60 mph
3rd=83 mph

The big difference is in 4th gear and that is where the RS has an advantage on a short technical track like Streets. The RS does not have to shift into 5th on the front and back straights of Streets. The MR has to go through two extra up shifts and two extra downshifts in one lap around Streets. And shifting SLOWS you down unless you have a sequential gearbox.

It is obvious to me that you have never driven under race conditions where you have many things going on at the same time. The last thing that you want is an extra gate on your shifter that you must use to complicate matters.

On Streets I go WOT through turn 1. I do not lift at all. A bit later you are hard on the brakes and shifting like a madman to be in the RIGHT gear for turn 2. I really do not want that extra shift. I would rather have a car that will keep me in 4th gear on the front and back straights of Streets.

Have you heard of NASA? I race with them too

 

FYI, the USDM MR is not 300 lbs. lighter than RS or GSR it is heavier than both unless you have a GSR with SSL, better check your facts.

 

i did not say that the MR is a better track car. the title of this post is, "HOW DOES MR DESERVE A $4500 over EVO??" So, I posted the results of last weekends tuner shoot out. I'm sure there were guys out there with modded evo's who thought the MR wasn't worth the money either, but fact was some "tuner" EVO's with thousands of dollars of mods ran slower times.

You act like the RS is several hundred pounds lighter than the MR. the weight discrepancy between the two could be easy masked by variance in driver weight.

Our driver doesn't lift on the 1st turn either, yet he still manages to get it into second by the next turn. yanno how he does it? it's called skill. If having an extra gear is such a huge handicap, how did the MR beat out the godly 5 speed tranny powered cars?

if you want to talk credentials, you really gotta be atleast a WC driver to impress me. i know plenty of people with NASA pro licenses.

the answer to the titled post to me is an easy one to answer. read this a few times so you can get it thru your thick skull. the MR is a respectable performer on the track against formitable competition, and it does so without compromising street civility. It has HID, power windows, power locks, a radio, a 6 speed tranny, ect. ect. All things that are COMPROMISED on the RS to accomplish the same thing. That is the value of the MR.

Even if the RS is faster at the track... which hasn't really been quantifiably tested... who cares... look what you had to give up to do so.

Have fun rolling down the passenger window from the driver seat, if you want to talk to someone on your right hand side.

 

that's it..I CALL BS!! This guy is not only a troll, he is either severly retarded but capable of slapping his paws on a keyboard like my dog, or just a lonely kid that logged on to a automotive forum and started talking ****. Either way, I don't believe that he owns an EVO MR, or even possesses a driver's license. Anyone who babbles on and on about crushing sport bikes and 11-12 second cars when his 13 second, stock EVO is blowing clutches and tires is ignorant beyond belief. The MR is a great car, as is the EVO VIII, if you own either, you should be proud. Please moderators ban this loudmouth chucklehead!!

 

also, yes your 90's sentra is a performance bargain compared to the 05' MR, but guess what? your sentras get spanked all day by honda civics. Nissan vs Honda shootout @ willow springs recap perhaps?

looking thru some old post the fast nissan that day was 1:33.1, so you're either bull****ting or you must have one of the fastest ser's on the planet. still slower than a stock evo MR tho.

 

nj266 what's your name?

also, are you aware that hotlap timers are known to be off by 1 to 1.5 secs compared to AMB?

Honda
Chad Slagg- 1:33.333
Keith Gillespie- 1:35.341 (in vtecvoodoo's eg hb, which despite problems still managed a good time. car has so much potential...)
Frank Yeung- 1:35.480
Dominque Montes- 1:35.513
Frank Lin- 1:35.638 (in hasport's EP3, heaviest honda @ 2900 lbs/driver)
Brian Gillespie- 1:36.819
Kenneth Montes- 1:36.935
Brian Parks- 1:38.483


Nissan
Amber Karqenian- 1:35.133
Rab Cadle- 1:35.301
Mike Kojima- 1:35.418
Dave Coleman- 1:35.628
Kathy Thomanson- 1:36.188
Jeff Nayert- 1:36.463
Charles Johnson- 1:36.842
George Dogians- 1:37.222


you should have entered the shootout you could have had 5 mins of fame. but i don't know how good of a driver you are if you can't even shift gears without missing in a 14-15 sec car.

 

save the hatred for a car worthy of your hostility Scoobydoo sti....

 

Hmm... my post was really comparing 05 MR to 05 Evos in term of what you get
for the money. Comparing 05 MR with pre-05 Evo is a bit pointless....obviously
05's more power and front LSD is going to have some advantage.

And from your post... MR with RA1 is still nearly 3 secs slower than all 6 of these
modded Evos...

 

Were you at the competition to see what the front runners looked like? There were about a total of 15 competitors, the fact that we didn't come in dead last in a bone stock car vs "tuner" cars is already a victory. If you can't even show a little bit of respect for that accomplishment... it just goes to show what a hater you are.

 

You are comparing an 05 MR to 03-04 GSRs with an open front differential. An open front differential is not an ideal set-up on a course like Streets. You need a front LSD on Steets with an AWD car. I am talking about the 05 RS vs. the 05 MR. I am not talking about the 03-04 EVO.
The RS is 88 lbs lighter than the MR. Every lb counts when it comes to weight reduction.
Why don't you drive your own car? Why do you have to go out and get someone else to drive YOUR car for you? The MR beat out 03-04 EVO. It did not beat out an 05 RS. Was there an 05 RS in the competition? I do not think there was one at all.
This is coming from someone who has to get someone else to drive his car so he can compete in the EVO shootout Do you have a NASA license? Have YOU raced in any amateur race series? Do you have any racing license at all?
Thanks for the insults. The MR preformed well against 03-04 EVOs. You have to compare it to an 05 GSR or 05 RS to find out if there is really any difference. At the track I really do not give a carp if the RS has all these amenities. The fewer power this and that, the less likely things will brake given the fact that the car is made by

 

I was not at this shootout. I had to work. And the Hotlap is NOT off by 1 to 1.5 seconds. I run a Hotlap and an AMB and I always compare the numbers. MY hotlap unit gives me SLOWER times than the AMB. I pulled a 1:36.099 at Big Willow the same day of the EVO shootout wiht the AMB. My hotlap unit flashed 1:36.11.

I have had my 5 minutes of fame. My race car was featured in Grassroots Motorsports magazine in the August 2004 issue. It is the Black 200SX SE-R.

I bet that I am a better driver than you. At least I drive at the events that I sign up for and I do not have to give my car to someone else to drive it fast for me