Comprehensive Evo STU prep thread?
Newbie
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
The wing held up well over the weekend and will likely be part of my Atwater setup
_J_
Last edited by spaf; Mar 29, 2007 at 07:01 PM.
Whether the part is legal or not we should understand the mentality of competitors at Nats. Hell, there is a thread on NASIOC about what to look for on other makes of cars, to protest - sorry Corey.
I was protested the first time I took the Evo out, and that was for a 4th place trophy at a Tour. Navid / Harrison almost got protested for not having the hood vent in ESP. In my few times at Nats I seen protests for reversed brake backing plates, cats a few inches located off from stock, slotted suspension mounting points, and Sti arms on a WRX. Most of which did not have any performance advantage that could have been done legally.
An SEB member has told me that I will be protested by a competitor, if I win a tour, for something I interpret as legal. In the past 2 years STU has been pretty lax, the winning car had an illegal intercooler hose and an Utek. Last year a Sti had a missing wing light, some of the M3s had overly flared fender lips and they inspected for fender liner holes. Now it’s a national class, folks will be more serious about rule infractions.
I was protested the first time I took the Evo out, and that was for a 4th place trophy at a Tour. Navid / Harrison almost got protested for not having the hood vent in ESP. In my few times at Nats I seen protests for reversed brake backing plates, cats a few inches located off from stock, slotted suspension mounting points, and Sti arms on a WRX. Most of which did not have any performance advantage that could have been done legally.
An SEB member has told me that I will be protested by a competitor, if I win a tour, for something I interpret as legal. In the past 2 years STU has been pretty lax, the winning car had an illegal intercooler hose and an Utek. Last year a Sti had a missing wing light, some of the M3s had overly flared fender lips and they inspected for fender liner holes. Now it’s a national class, folks will be more serious about rule infractions.
(smack talk on)
Well as long as you are driving I've got nuttin' to worry about bish.
(smack talk off)
Thanks Adam. We've still got quite a way to go with the car. I still need the
suspension, bushings, wheels and tires on the car. In the next few weeks
she should be ready. Power wise it shot at the next turn so doggone fast I always felt like I was behind the car.
O.T.
When are you up for some more slot-car action and beer? We've gotta get
Derek and Chad over too, maybe the wimmenz can come too. (designated drivers)
Dave Mac
Well as long as you are driving I've got nuttin' to worry about bish.
(smack talk off)
Thanks Adam. We've still got quite a way to go with the car. I still need the
suspension, bushings, wheels and tires on the car. In the next few weeks
she should be ready. Power wise it shot at the next turn so doggone fast I always felt like I was behind the car.
O.T.
When are you up for some more slot-car action and beer? We've gotta get
Derek and Chad over too, maybe the wimmenz can come too. (designated drivers)
Dave Mac
How's it going? No offense intended to you the tuner or Branden. I was talking about '05 when the rules were a gray area and no one was really prepped. I remembered someone pointing out the silicone short connector hose on a STI, and heard Branden say the Utek? was legally configured, after someone said that particular unit may not be allowed. The discussion, while standing in front of the cars in grid, was how the rules should be changed to accomodate these mods - as they were not performance adders. If we go this year, I was thinking of possibly having you tweak our tune before nats.
Are you guys still interested in getting some of the race cats? I think we almost have enough interest to make an another order, if some of the earlier people still want them.
The winning Evo VIII and IX, and the top M3 at the San Diego Tour and the El Toro ProSolo were running the race cat in STU. If any one else is interested let me know, as some of the STU suby guys want some too.
Last edited by SS RX7 r2; Mar 31, 2007 at 07:56 AM.
Like I said in my email to you... put me down for 2 of them. If it's not going to happen for a while though then I might just get a RT cat and call it a day. Keep me updated on the status.
Jason U,
GREAT job at the Pro. Sounds like this "wing" has a story behind it. Care to share?
Corey #89 STU
Hey Jake,
How's it going? No offense intended to you the tuner or Branden. I was talking about '05 when the rules were a gray area and no one was really prepped. I remembered someone pointing out the silicone short connector hose on a STI, and heard Branden say the Utek? was legally configured, after someone said that particular unit may not be allowed. The discussion, while standing in front of the cars in grid, was how the rules should be changed to accomodate these mods - as they were not performance adders. If we go this year, I was thinking of possibly having you tweak our tune before nats.
Are you guys still interested in getting some of the race cats? I think we almost have enough interest to make an another order, if some of the earlier people still want them.
The winning Evo VIII and IX, and the top M3 at the San Diego Tour and the El Toro ProSolo were running them in STU. If any one else is interested let me know, as some of the STU suby guys want some too.
How's it going? No offense intended to you the tuner or Branden. I was talking about '05 when the rules were a gray area and no one was really prepped. I remembered someone pointing out the silicone short connector hose on a STI, and heard Branden say the Utek? was legally configured, after someone said that particular unit may not be allowed. The discussion, while standing in front of the cars in grid, was how the rules should be changed to accomodate these mods - as they were not performance adders. If we go this year, I was thinking of possibly having you tweak our tune before nats.
Are you guys still interested in getting some of the race cats? I think we almost have enough interest to make an another order, if some of the earlier people still want them.
The winning Evo VIII and IX, and the top M3 at the San Diego Tour and the El Toro ProSolo were running them in STU. If any one else is interested let me know, as some of the STU suby guys want some too.
I remember the short silicone hose. It was on a blue car though if I remember correctly. I also remember taking Branden's car through tech and asking if what we had done to modify the UTEC so that it could not control boost was legal in 2005. We had to get a member of SEB to look at it and they cleared it. In 06 we went to a flash like everyone else and actually Branden's car made more power. I also remember in '06 talking to Neary and offering to show to him post day 2 how the evo and sti guys could cheat(both electronically and mechanically) and show him everything in my laptop. I bring my laptop with everyone's tunes in it to grid with me so that if a protest occours I'm able to help my customer prove his innocence.
I'm definatly down for a couple of good high flow cats. Mom and I are both on the magnaflows right now and they are decent at best. Put me down for 2 if you want.
Always remember the monday, tuesday, and wed. before the pro we have a three day dyno day to "tweek" cars. You are always more than welcome to join in.
Evolving Member
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
From: York, PA
Dave,
You may be able to take me in autocross but you don't wanna talk smack when it comes to slot cars baby!
Look out beeeootch!
Don't forget, technically you haven't beat me in the two events we've done so far................ Hey, I can cling to my 15 minutes of fame right? I have a feeling once the first 2007 events rolls around I may be changing my tune!!! haha
-Derek
You may be able to take me in autocross but you don't wanna talk smack when it comes to slot cars baby!
Look out beeeootch!
Don't forget, technically you haven't beat me in the two events we've done so far................ Hey, I can cling to my 15 minutes of fame right? I have a feeling once the first 2007 events rolls around I may be changing my tune!!! haha
-Derek
Jake,
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
Jake,
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
I understand. Back in June of 05 when we put it on the car I was still building nothing but drag cars out of my shop. I left it on Branden to look up the ruleset. After he won nats in 05 I took a more aggressive approach to learning the rules to the best of my abilities. I think I have more than one post on the SCCA forums asking about parts legality with regards to computers, clutches, and other stuff. When I read through the rules after nats in 05 I convinced Branden to rip it out and switch to a flash. He ran that flash ALL of 06 and at nats in 06.
Jake,
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
The "Utec" was and is, in fact, illegal related to ignition timing. Controlling the fuel via Utec is legal because it acts like a piggy-back modifying the factory ECU MAF/ MAP signal. The illegal part of the Utec is on ignition timing since it has full and complete control. Similar to a stand-alone. It's been a while since this was discussed, but I recall the Utec has it's own ignition firing modules. Well before Brandon arrived at Nat's in 2005, this topic was discussed extensively on the Subie boards (as well as other performance forums) and found to be illegal.
Personally, with today's reflashing technology, complete control over the ignition means squat. No added performance benefit within the limited confines of STU mods/rules.
Brandon just plain out-drove everyone in 05'.
Dave
What's everyone's thoughts around whether helper springs are a necessity on the Evo for Autox?
The stock suspension is notorious for picking up the rear inside wheel and even when going with a stiff coilover setup, unless it has helper springs it's still pretty likely the inside rear wheel will lift. Any thoughts for the those that have had more experience in STU with various coilover setups?
The stock suspension is notorious for picking up the rear inside wheel and even when going with a stiff coilover setup, unless it has helper springs it's still pretty likely the inside rear wheel will lift. Any thoughts for the those that have had more experience in STU with various coilover setups?
What's everyone's thoughts around whether helper springs are a necessity on the Evo for Autox?
The stock suspension is notorious for picking up the rear inside wheel and even when going with a stiff coilover setup, unless it has helper springs it's still pretty likely the inside rear wheel will lift. Any thoughts for the those that have had more experience in STU with various coilover setups?
The stock suspension is notorious for picking up the rear inside wheel and even when going with a stiff coilover setup, unless it has helper springs it's still pretty likely the inside rear wheel will lift. Any thoughts for the those that have had more experience in STU with various coilover setups?
It's my opinion that with the right roll stiffness and sufficient rear droop travel that you can reduce rear inside wheel lift to an inconsequential level on an STU Evo.