how does Shiv feel about the 20GIX turbo
Originally Posted by Ted B
And I am one who happens to have the Buschur EVO-9 20G with TiAl wheel. My unit has the 5-bladed compressor, which was installed after the fact by F.P.
My previous turbo was a TME. I installed and dyno tuned the 20G-9-T less than two weeks ago. The only other mod made at this time was an upgrade from a JDM-MR BOV to a Forge adjustable unit. Nothing else was changed.
So, what are my comments?
First and foremost, let me preface this by denoting that I am hearing a whistle that I've never heard before. It sounds like it keeps pace with the compressor, and actually starts while the manifold pressure is still in vacuum, but moving in a positive direction. If this whistle is a leak of some sort, I do not know. If so, that's good news given my results. If not, then I'm not very impressed.
Onto the nitty gritty . . .
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti spools some 250-300rpm slower.
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti made an additional 10whp or so at the hp peak. . . although we're forcing the 20G-9-Ti to hold an additional 3-4 psi above 5000rpm.
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti was down significantly on torque until ~5000rpm. . . but we're forcing the 20G-9-Ti to hold an additional 3-4 psi above 5000rpm.
Now here is what's interesting, around 4000rpm, with the TME and 20G-9-Ti *both* at 25psi, the TME gave some 50ft/lbs greater torque with no significant changes in AFR or timing.
How can this be?
It could be that I have a leak (whistle?), which is causing the 20G-9-Ti to run harder to reach the same boost pressure. We tried raising the boost from 25 to 28 psi, and saw zero increase in torque, which may support that theory.
In summary, the jury is still out, but before I invest more time and money into it, I am actively asking for anyone else with A/B dyno results to come forward as soon as you get them so we can compare.
My previous turbo was a TME. I installed and dyno tuned the 20G-9-T less than two weeks ago. The only other mod made at this time was an upgrade from a JDM-MR BOV to a Forge adjustable unit. Nothing else was changed.
So, what are my comments?
First and foremost, let me preface this by denoting that I am hearing a whistle that I've never heard before. It sounds like it keeps pace with the compressor, and actually starts while the manifold pressure is still in vacuum, but moving in a positive direction. If this whistle is a leak of some sort, I do not know. If so, that's good news given my results. If not, then I'm not very impressed.
Onto the nitty gritty . . .
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti spools some 250-300rpm slower.
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti made an additional 10whp or so at the hp peak. . . although we're forcing the 20G-9-Ti to hold an additional 3-4 psi above 5000rpm.
- As compared to the TME, the 20G-9-Ti was down significantly on torque until ~5000rpm. . . but we're forcing the 20G-9-Ti to hold an additional 3-4 psi above 5000rpm.
Now here is what's interesting, around 4000rpm, with the TME and 20G-9-Ti *both* at 25psi, the TME gave some 50ft/lbs greater torque with no significant changes in AFR or timing.
How can this be?
It could be that I have a leak (whistle?), which is causing the 20G-9-Ti to run harder to reach the same boost pressure. We tried raising the boost from 25 to 28 psi, and saw zero increase in torque, which may support that theory.
In summary, the jury is still out, but before I invest more time and money into it, I am actively asking for anyone else with A/B dyno results to come forward as soon as you get them so we can compare.
My WR "whines" noticably louder than the stock turbo. Especially noticable on spool-up. I think the 5 bladed design is "Noiser" than the stock units. My whine only starts when out of vacuum.
Originally Posted by davidbuschur
I saw this under hot topics so thought I'd read it. I had no intention of chiming in.
Superhatch,
Not sure who you are, some of your facts are straight, some aren't. That is all I want to clear up.
Turbochargers, long ago, maybe even in 2003, tried to build a turbo that would work for the EVO. The sent it to us. It used a Ford Powerstroke compressor wheel. This was their attempt at making a bolt on turbo for the EVO. It sucked, they came apart, they failed. HORRIBLE attempt at a turbo. Non of this was public, they sent it to us to test for them. I got tired of them failing and finally said to them that we needed to make a TD05H 20G turbo just like the DSM's turbos that we built, sold and had such great success with. I spent thousands of dollars getting a wheel CNC'd, non of them worked out well because of the poor machining that was being done. TC found a shop that actually makes compressor wheels for some large manufacturers. He then sent an actual Mitsubishi 20G compressor wheel there and asked them to make an exact copy of it except reverse rotation. So to say it isn't a 20G, as you did, isn't true. The best desciption of it is a reverse rotation 20G as it is an exact copy. We have ran this compressor wheel with the TD05H turbine wheels in the DSM's for the last 10+ years with huge success. Even John Shepherd swears by the turbo and says to this day it is the best turbo on a street 4G63. My car Talon, after John bought it, was driven to a 10.72 at 131 mph with this turbo. I was only capable of 11.05 at 127 with it. These results are going to be repeated with the reverse rotation turbo, you can bank on that.
I don't know when FP started their WR wheel. We said we were working on one first but that doesn't matter.
Turbochargers has NEVER had ANY EVO9 turbos in their building unless I shipped them there. 1 brand new unit I bought from Mitsubishi before anyone else experimented with one and then 7 more that I bought from FP and had sent to TC to have converted to 20G's.
Then Robert at FP wanted me to try his WR. Which I had only ever seen on 1 car ever, so I never said our wheel outperformed his as I never tested one until about 2 months ago on my own. Anyway he built a special unit for me, different turbine wheel mods and used the EVO9 turbo for the base as I was having good luck with them. When I got the turbo I tested it against the 20G wheel. The results were the same. HP/torque and spool up were basically identical.
To this day TC does not have EVO9 turbos in stock. They ordered 100 units, as that is what I asked them to do. In the meantime I had tested the FP turbo, modified for us, and found the performance and such to be the same so I used them. I told TC that when he got turbos in I would take them from him again. Until then I would use FP for the turbos. TC decided that since I wasn't ordering from them I was done using them. That's BS, I wasn't ordering because he had no product. I think it was his way out of our deal of me exclusive on them. I did all the work on the turbos etc.
That's the majority of the story in what actually happened.
Thanks for your time. Shiv, hope you don't mind me posting this here.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
Superhatch,
Not sure who you are, some of your facts are straight, some aren't. That is all I want to clear up.
Turbochargers, long ago, maybe even in 2003, tried to build a turbo that would work for the EVO. The sent it to us. It used a Ford Powerstroke compressor wheel. This was their attempt at making a bolt on turbo for the EVO. It sucked, they came apart, they failed. HORRIBLE attempt at a turbo. Non of this was public, they sent it to us to test for them. I got tired of them failing and finally said to them that we needed to make a TD05H 20G turbo just like the DSM's turbos that we built, sold and had such great success with. I spent thousands of dollars getting a wheel CNC'd, non of them worked out well because of the poor machining that was being done. TC found a shop that actually makes compressor wheels for some large manufacturers. He then sent an actual Mitsubishi 20G compressor wheel there and asked them to make an exact copy of it except reverse rotation. So to say it isn't a 20G, as you did, isn't true. The best desciption of it is a reverse rotation 20G as it is an exact copy. We have ran this compressor wheel with the TD05H turbine wheels in the DSM's for the last 10+ years with huge success. Even John Shepherd swears by the turbo and says to this day it is the best turbo on a street 4G63. My car Talon, after John bought it, was driven to a 10.72 at 131 mph with this turbo. I was only capable of 11.05 at 127 with it. These results are going to be repeated with the reverse rotation turbo, you can bank on that.
I don't know when FP started their WR wheel. We said we were working on one first but that doesn't matter.
Turbochargers has NEVER had ANY EVO9 turbos in their building unless I shipped them there. 1 brand new unit I bought from Mitsubishi before anyone else experimented with one and then 7 more that I bought from FP and had sent to TC to have converted to 20G's.
Then Robert at FP wanted me to try his WR. Which I had only ever seen on 1 car ever, so I never said our wheel outperformed his as I never tested one until about 2 months ago on my own. Anyway he built a special unit for me, different turbine wheel mods and used the EVO9 turbo for the base as I was having good luck with them. When I got the turbo I tested it against the 20G wheel. The results were the same. HP/torque and spool up were basically identical.
To this day TC does not have EVO9 turbos in stock. They ordered 100 units, as that is what I asked them to do. In the meantime I had tested the FP turbo, modified for us, and found the performance and such to be the same so I used them. I told TC that when he got turbos in I would take them from him again. Until then I would use FP for the turbos. TC decided that since I wasn't ordering from them I was done using them. That's BS, I wasn't ordering because he had no product. I think it was his way out of our deal of me exclusive on them. I did all the work on the turbos etc.
That's the majority of the story in what actually happened.
Thanks for your time. Shiv, hope you don't mind me posting this here.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
I only posted out of what I've read/heard. I spoke to Dave at TC about this, and I've read probably 2000 out of the 5000 WR/20G posts made, sometimes it gets tough to sort everything out, but that's what I came up with, which as you said, wasn't that far off from the truth.
- Steve
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According to a Garret engineer I've spoken to about these topics, turbo noise/whistling/etc,. is usually a symptom of being out-of-balance.
A boost leak would manifest itself as a "whooshing" sound. MAF values would also be higher than normal and be accompanied by rich-run conditions.
my 2c,
shiv
A boost leak would manifest itself as a "whooshing" sound. MAF values would also be higher than normal and be accompanied by rich-run conditions.
my 2c,
shiv
Originally Posted by Ted B
First and foremost, let me preface this by denoting that I am hearing a whistle that I've never heard before. It sounds like it keeps pace with the compressor, and actually starts while the manifold pressure is still in vacuum, but moving in a positive direction. If this whistle is a leak of some sort, I do not know. If so, that's good news given my results. If not, then I'm not very impressed.
Brian
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Originally Posted by steve_evo
The 20G-IX from turbochargers.com has a version with the titanium aluminide turbine.. which is really all that the TME has to offer.
Couple that with a bigger compressor wheel AND cover... wouldn't this result in big power gains along with quicker spool-up?
Couple that with a bigger compressor wheel AND cover... wouldn't this result in big power gains along with quicker spool-up?
A larger compressor will have to spin slower to move the same air. Now the turbine is forced to spin slower which will move it to another place on its turbine map. This place may be better or worse than before. If it's worse, it will result in more exhaust backpressure which would explain why the several extra psi of boost that people are running with these turbos aren't resulting in gobs more power. Just remind yourself how much more power a GT30R makes at the same boost pressure that people are spinning their "20gs" to. It is blessed with a more appropriate speed match between the hot and cold side. The larger turbine hurts spool-up, of course. But it does wonderful things to power at higher engine speeds.
Now if you spin the larger compressor the same speed you spun the TME, it will move more air and create more exhaust flow. Now you are asking the same turbine to move more exhaust flow which will create backpressure. Sure, you can clip the wheel to help get the exhaust gases out. But unfortunately, clipping results in a big reduction in turbine efficiency which hurts spool-up and power.
So no, it's not as easy as just bolting on a bigger compressor wheel, compressor housing and clipping the turbine wheel. All that work just juggles around compromises that may or may not work out in your favor.
Just my 2c,
shiv
Originally Posted by davidbuschur
I saw this under hot topics so thought I'd read it. I had no intention of chiming in.
Superhatch,
Not sure who you are, some of your facts are straight, some aren't. That is all I want to clear up.
Turbochargers, long ago, maybe even in 2003, tried to build a turbo that would work for the EVO. The sent it to us. It used a Ford Powerstroke compressor wheel. This was their attempt at making a bolt on turbo for the EVO. It sucked, they came apart, they failed. HORRIBLE attempt at a turbo. Non of this was public, they sent it to us to test for them. I got tired of them failing and finally said to them that we needed to make a TD05H 20G turbo just like the DSM's turbos that we built, sold and had such great success with. I spent thousands of dollars getting a wheel CNC'd, non of them worked out well because of the poor machining that was being done. TC found a shop that actually makes compressor wheels for some large manufacturers. He then sent an actual Mitsubishi 20G compressor wheel there and asked them to make an exact copy of it except reverse rotation. So to say it isn't a 20G, as you did, isn't true. The best desciption of it is a reverse rotation 20G as it is an exact copy. We have ran this compressor wheel with the TD05H turbine wheels in the DSM's for the last 10+ years with huge success. Even John Shepherd swears by the turbo and says to this day it is the best turbo on a street 4G63. My car Talon, after John bought it, was driven to a 10.72 at 131 mph with this turbo. I was only capable of 11.05 at 127 with it. These results are going to be repeated with the reverse rotation turbo, you can bank on that.
I don't know when FP started their WR wheel. We said we were working on one first but that doesn't matter.
Turbochargers has NEVER had ANY EVO9 turbos in their building unless I shipped them there. 1 brand new unit I bought from Mitsubishi before anyone else experimented with one and then 7 more that I bought from FP and had sent to TC to have converted to 20G's.
Then Robert at FP wanted me to try his WR. Which I had only ever seen on 1 car ever, so I never said our wheel outperformed his as I never tested one until about 2 months ago on my own. Anyway he built a special unit for me, different turbine wheel mods and used the EVO9 turbo for the base as I was having good luck with them. When I got the turbo I tested it against the 20G wheel. The results were the same. HP/torque and spool up were basically identical.
To this day TC does not have EVO9 turbos in stock. They ordered 100 units, as that is what I asked them to do. In the meantime I had tested the FP turbo, modified for us, and found the performance and such to be the same so I used them. I told TC that when he got turbos in I would take them from him again. Until then I would use FP for the turbos. TC decided that since I wasn't ordering from them I was done using them. That's BS, I wasn't ordering because he had no product. I think it was his way out of our deal of me exclusive on them. I did all the work on the turbos etc.
That's the majority of the story in what actually happened.
Thanks for your time. Shiv, hope you don't mind me posting this here.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
Superhatch,
Not sure who you are, some of your facts are straight, some aren't. That is all I want to clear up.
Turbochargers, long ago, maybe even in 2003, tried to build a turbo that would work for the EVO. The sent it to us. It used a Ford Powerstroke compressor wheel. This was their attempt at making a bolt on turbo for the EVO. It sucked, they came apart, they failed. HORRIBLE attempt at a turbo. Non of this was public, they sent it to us to test for them. I got tired of them failing and finally said to them that we needed to make a TD05H 20G turbo just like the DSM's turbos that we built, sold and had such great success with. I spent thousands of dollars getting a wheel CNC'd, non of them worked out well because of the poor machining that was being done. TC found a shop that actually makes compressor wheels for some large manufacturers. He then sent an actual Mitsubishi 20G compressor wheel there and asked them to make an exact copy of it except reverse rotation. So to say it isn't a 20G, as you did, isn't true. The best desciption of it is a reverse rotation 20G as it is an exact copy. We have ran this compressor wheel with the TD05H turbine wheels in the DSM's for the last 10+ years with huge success. Even John Shepherd swears by the turbo and says to this day it is the best turbo on a street 4G63. My car Talon, after John bought it, was driven to a 10.72 at 131 mph with this turbo. I was only capable of 11.05 at 127 with it. These results are going to be repeated with the reverse rotation turbo, you can bank on that.
I don't know when FP started their WR wheel. We said we were working on one first but that doesn't matter.
Turbochargers has NEVER had ANY EVO9 turbos in their building unless I shipped them there. 1 brand new unit I bought from Mitsubishi before anyone else experimented with one and then 7 more that I bought from FP and had sent to TC to have converted to 20G's.
Then Robert at FP wanted me to try his WR. Which I had only ever seen on 1 car ever, so I never said our wheel outperformed his as I never tested one until about 2 months ago on my own. Anyway he built a special unit for me, different turbine wheel mods and used the EVO9 turbo for the base as I was having good luck with them. When I got the turbo I tested it against the 20G wheel. The results were the same. HP/torque and spool up were basically identical.
To this day TC does not have EVO9 turbos in stock. They ordered 100 units, as that is what I asked them to do. In the meantime I had tested the FP turbo, modified for us, and found the performance and such to be the same so I used them. I told TC that when he got turbos in I would take them from him again. Until then I would use FP for the turbos. TC decided that since I wasn't ordering from them I was done using them. That's BS, I wasn't ordering because he had no product. I think it was his way out of our deal of me exclusive on them. I did all the work on the turbos etc.
That's the majority of the story in what actually happened.
Thanks for your time. Shiv, hope you don't mind me posting this here.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
Has anyone confirmed that the 50lb loss of tq is because of a boost leak or a unbalance issue of the 20G IX?
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I posted this in January and got flamed as usual. I am a Prophet. I am better than Nausterdamas. Call me Master-Dumbazz! 1st thread is after reality and 2nd thread was before when predictions were made. Me and Smoggy were crucified(exagerated a lil) for warning the sheep but they ran off the cliff anyways and the big bad wolf got a feast. We tried to warn them about the HYPE but were just viewed by the Sheep as Pessimistic azzholes. Yeah as usual Speedlimit warned me to chill. So I did and got banned later for the Beer can/boostleak cross reference thread.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...46#post2758646
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ed...post&p=2719231
U do not know how to quantify percentages.
IMO, If this 20G-9 can make 420 whp( DJ #s) on an Evo with basic bolt-ons; that would be great and worth it for many as a viable upgrade option. If it gets 450 whp that would be insane and the best possible turbo upgrade in history for the Evo.
My prediction is that an Evo 8 with all the BPUs and stock internals will likely push close to 400 whp on a DJ. Some might do a lil more, but from what I see in Dave's numbers, I feel that I am being optimistic. He has a FrankenEvo with more mods than most and based off of previous dyno comparisons he appears to be hovering around 400 whp on a DJ. Do the math and really compare the numbers between his dyno and other tuners dynos.
U will conclude that the variance in the numbers are exaggerated and 25-33% is absurd. Also lets forget about his 2800pnd RS trapping 124 mph with great no lift drivers at the helm. It only proves that David's RS is`light and his homies can drive.
The Hype on Evo M never ceases to amaze me and in the next couple months we will find out if this turbo upgrade is Hype or the real deal. I hope the Sheep(Guinea Pigs) are not mislead by their Shepard on this venture. We all remember the poor Sheep took one on the chin on the White Rabbit hype and the ATP 3071 debacle.I have been around long enough to see that there is alot of Koolaid being sold on Evo M and I am not drinking any until I see a 20G-9 put down some real world results outside of Ohio.
__________________
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...46#post2758646
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ed...post&p=2719231
U do not know how to quantify percentages.
IMO, If this 20G-9 can make 420 whp( DJ #s) on an Evo with basic bolt-ons; that would be great and worth it for many as a viable upgrade option. If it gets 450 whp that would be insane and the best possible turbo upgrade in history for the Evo.
My prediction is that an Evo 8 with all the BPUs and stock internals will likely push close to 400 whp on a DJ. Some might do a lil more, but from what I see in Dave's numbers, I feel that I am being optimistic. He has a FrankenEvo with more mods than most and based off of previous dyno comparisons he appears to be hovering around 400 whp on a DJ. Do the math and really compare the numbers between his dyno and other tuners dynos.
U will conclude that the variance in the numbers are exaggerated and 25-33% is absurd. Also lets forget about his 2800pnd RS trapping 124 mph with great no lift drivers at the helm. It only proves that David's RS is`light and his homies can drive.
The Hype on Evo M never ceases to amaze me and in the next couple months we will find out if this turbo upgrade is Hype or the real deal. I hope the Sheep(Guinea Pigs) are not mislead by their Shepard on this venture. We all remember the poor Sheep took one on the chin on the White Rabbit hype and the ATP 3071 debacle.I have been around long enough to see that there is alot of Koolaid being sold on Evo M and I am not drinking any until I see a 20G-9 put down some real world results outside of Ohio.
__________________
Last edited by IE Evo; Mar 2, 2006 at 12:48 AM.
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Prophet Smoggy in action.
Links:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ne...eply&p=2719058
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ne...eply&p=2718898
Actually, IMHO, Dave more often blows expectations out of proportion and backs off less often. Just read the couple of threads where he continually repeats 20g 8 at 328whp = 124mph. Then look at his 500whp on a dynojet statements. It took me nipping at his ankles before he reminded everyone of just how extensively his RS has been modified.
Also, have you seen Evom member Creamo3's signature? https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/members/9726-creamo3.html
Are those dyno #'s from Al's tune with the 20g? That was on race fuel at 26psi.[/QUOTE]
More:
[QUOTE=Smogrunner]I'm going to make some predictions:
1. The Buschur dyno controversies will go on for a long time for good reason. I personally think DBs dyno reads pretty much the same as the Gruppe-S and the Full Function Mustang dynos in california.
2. Typical good drivers (Warrtalon, Ivan_C, Matt55, etc) with perfectly tuned BR Stage 4s w/20g 9's will do no better than 121mph in the 1/4 on race gas and will typically run 118 mph on race gas. But that is about 3 mph better than the typical stock turbo cars, so that is not bad at all.
By the way, one of the best amatuer drag racers on this board dynoed 364whp on DB's dyno and managed a best trap speed of 117.6 at 11.79.
Links:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ne...eply&p=2719058
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ne...eply&p=2718898
Actually, IMHO, Dave more often blows expectations out of proportion and backs off less often. Just read the couple of threads where he continually repeats 20g 8 at 328whp = 124mph. Then look at his 500whp on a dynojet statements. It took me nipping at his ankles before he reminded everyone of just how extensively his RS has been modified.
Also, have you seen Evom member Creamo3's signature? https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/members/9726-creamo3.html
Are those dyno #'s from Al's tune with the 20g? That was on race fuel at 26psi.[/QUOTE]
More:
[QUOTE=Smogrunner]I'm going to make some predictions:
1. The Buschur dyno controversies will go on for a long time for good reason. I personally think DBs dyno reads pretty much the same as the Gruppe-S and the Full Function Mustang dynos in california.
2. Typical good drivers (Warrtalon, Ivan_C, Matt55, etc) with perfectly tuned BR Stage 4s w/20g 9's will do no better than 121mph in the 1/4 on race gas and will typically run 118 mph on race gas. But that is about 3 mph better than the typical stock turbo cars, so that is not bad at all.
By the way, one of the best amatuer drag racers on this board dynoed 364whp on DB's dyno and managed a best trap speed of 117.6 at 11.79.
Last edited by IE Evo; Mar 2, 2006 at 12:40 AM.
Originally Posted by IE Evo
Also, have you seen Evom member Creamo3's signature? https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/members/9726-creamo3.html
Are those dyno #'s from Al's tune with the 20g? That was on race fuel at 26psi.
Are those dyno #'s from Al's tune with the 20g? That was on race fuel at 26psi.
Originally Posted by TURBODAWG
I have a WR that was converted to an Evo 9 WR. I have the exact same noise that you are talking about. The noise on mine starts while still in vacuum but approaching positive pressure. It seems to go away or at least get diminished by the exhaust noise at higher boost pressure.
Well, at least I'm not the only one, which tells us that it almost certainly isn't a leak. If it is an imbalance as Shiv suggested, that isn't good. Actually, that would seem to be a genuine concern if clipping and rebalancing is required, and obviously it is. There is a possible source of error there, but whether or not it IS an imbalance remains to be determined. Obviously, if it is, that won't do anything for power or longevity. If not, it's just a quirky characteristic of this turbo.
If I had to offer observations at this point, I can say in favor of the 20G-9 that it does make a little more peak hp both on pump and with methanol than the TME. The tradeoff however appears to be a loss in performance below 5000rpm. The 20G-9 would probably fare better against a stock EVO8 turbo.
At this point in time, do I feel that the 20G-9 is a viable upgrade? For a factory EVO8 turbo, where the 20G-9 is an endpoint and best peak power numbers with similar spool characteristics are desired, maybe so. For those already with a TME? No. In fact, the car was definitely more fun to drive with the TME. I damn sure wish it wasn't that way, but it is. Unfortunately, raising the boost pressure beyond ~25psi made NO difference anywhere, and that comes contrary to my expectations.
Had I upgraded from a factory turbo, I'd be fine with things the way they are. However, going from a TME to the 20G-9 has cost me a great deal of money in parts, installation, and dyno time, and I have mostly a loss in low speed punch with only very modest gains in peak power. Obviously, I'm not satisfied with the status quo, which means that it's going to cost me again to swap out of it. Needless to say, I am NOT happy about that.
I.E. Evo.... Here are some results from the Evo 9 WR, bought as an upgrade from Forced Performance. It never came through Buschurs shop. It is on a complete bolt on Evo 9. We dynoed and had this car tuned in NC.
I need to preface this by saying that because of an unproperly preloaded wastegate actuator we were having to spike to very high boost pressure to get it to hold 23 to 24 psi by 7500 RPM. But the HP max is obtained after the boost has fallen to 24 psi.
We have since corrected that issue, and the car is able to run 30 psi max and hold 25 to 26 psi. Or you can run it to 35 psi peak and hold 29 psi at 7k rpm.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...torque+monster
So the torque numbers would go down some, but the HP should go up slightly. Keep in mind there was ZERO port work at all done on this car. We installed everything as it came from the manufacturer... We were running 100 unleaded octane fuel.
FWIW to you, we have had an STi dyno with the exact same tune on this Mustang Dyno and the Dynojet at Topspeed in Atlanta. We have found there to be about an 10% to 11% variance in dynonumbers between these two dynos. This is without doing the parasitic drivetrain lose calculation. So using the highest numbers we got on the Mustang (without parasitic drive losses taken in to account).... We should see 378 whp x 1.10 = 415.8 whp at Topspeeds dynojet. This is purely an estimate.
And also we were using an HKS Carbon Titanium exhaust that taper to almost 2 1/2" at the cat connection and it doesnt pass the famous "BEER CAN", that your Mentor came up with... LOL.. We have since switched to the Greddy Titanium and the car owner claims he could feel the difference in the car. The car also has an APS FMIC and AMS lower IC pipe on it now. Everything else has remained the same. We will dyno again shortly to see how much power we have picked up.
I feel fairly certain, that on an Evo 8 with bolt on mods and proper tuning on race gas (min 100 octane), with this turbo that 400 whp on a dynojet should not be a problem. You would need to run at least 24 to 25 psi at HP peak to obtain these numbers.
Brian
I need to preface this by saying that because of an unproperly preloaded wastegate actuator we were having to spike to very high boost pressure to get it to hold 23 to 24 psi by 7500 RPM. But the HP max is obtained after the boost has fallen to 24 psi.
We have since corrected that issue, and the car is able to run 30 psi max and hold 25 to 26 psi. Or you can run it to 35 psi peak and hold 29 psi at 7k rpm.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...torque+monster
So the torque numbers would go down some, but the HP should go up slightly. Keep in mind there was ZERO port work at all done on this car. We installed everything as it came from the manufacturer... We were running 100 unleaded octane fuel.
FWIW to you, we have had an STi dyno with the exact same tune on this Mustang Dyno and the Dynojet at Topspeed in Atlanta. We have found there to be about an 10% to 11% variance in dynonumbers between these two dynos. This is without doing the parasitic drivetrain lose calculation. So using the highest numbers we got on the Mustang (without parasitic drive losses taken in to account).... We should see 378 whp x 1.10 = 415.8 whp at Topspeeds dynojet. This is purely an estimate.
And also we were using an HKS Carbon Titanium exhaust that taper to almost 2 1/2" at the cat connection and it doesnt pass the famous "BEER CAN", that your Mentor came up with... LOL.. We have since switched to the Greddy Titanium and the car owner claims he could feel the difference in the car. The car also has an APS FMIC and AMS lower IC pipe on it now. Everything else has remained the same. We will dyno again shortly to see how much power we have picked up.
I feel fairly certain, that on an Evo 8 with bolt on mods and proper tuning on race gas (min 100 octane), with this turbo that 400 whp on a dynojet should not be a problem. You would need to run at least 24 to 25 psi at HP peak to obtain these numbers.
Brian
Originally Posted by TURBODAWG
I feel fairly certain, that on an Evo 8 with bolt on mods and proper tuning on race gas (min 100 octane), with this turbo that 400 whp on a dynojet should not be a problem. You would need to run at least 24 to 25 psi at HP peak to obtain these numbers.
If I can make 382 at the wheels (Dynojet) on 100 octane with a stock 03 turbo, 10.5 hotside, and ~20lbs of boost at HP peak. Why does a "more effiecient" compressor need to run 4-5 more lbs of boost to make marginally more power?
I always try to be a little pessimistic.... If you can make that on the 16G6 wheel at 20 psi, then you should be able to do at least the same if not better with the WR Evo 9 with the same mods. The bigger compressor wheel and housing WILL make more peak power....
Brian
Brian