Understood.. I'm just a "Highly motivated" enthusiastic individual.. LOL

 

Haha, I am starting to understand that about you!

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

Not the compressor wheel, the TURBINE wheel is made of titanium aluminide, this wheel is about 30% lighter than stock so it allows the turbo to spool much faster.

For anyone interested we have the Standard TDO5H-16G, 10.5 turbine housing with the lightweight turbine wheel for $975. This turbo can be upgraded to the 20G later if you want to or you can just have this much faster spooling turbo with more top end power now.

This turbine wheel is a factory built Mitsubishi part, so the strenght I am going to have to guess is no issue at all.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com


Hi... newguy here... I've been following this thread shortly after it started and finally got around to reading all 10 pages of it... I'm really interested in the upgraded 16g... I don't wanna get crazy with the 20g conversion. Stge 3 - 4 is out of my budget... And my question is, what is needed to support the TDO5H-16G, 10.5 turbine housing with the lightweight turbine wheel? Also, what kind discount could I get with a core trade in? Thanks in advance.

 

how much more does a 20G flow over the 16g? I was trying to look up compressor maps but i couldnt find any for the 20G

 

DaGul,

Putting the larger turbo on the car without performing the staged ugrades first is a dumb way to go through the upgrades. (no offense intended, just couldn't think of a better way to say it)

I started another thread on here that has some dyno work we are been doing on it. Check that out and you will see how important it is to build on each part as you go. This new turbo completely maxed out might be good for an additional 50 whp compared to the stock turbo. The turbo is going to cost you in the range of $1500. For $1310 you can get our stage 1 upgrade and add about 80 whp to your car. The turbo just bolted to your stock EVO would add little if anything.

The 20G flows an additional 150 cfm over the 16g if I remember correctly.

GOOD NEWS. I was told yesterday that the company making the wheels has already made corrections to the last mistake and is suppose to have another test wheel done and is en-route to be checked.

I also have a local machinist with an MR working on CNC'ing some for me directly. Someone is bound to get these done sooner or later!

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

Cant wait for this to come out.Would you have to upgrade the stock intercoller for this bigger wheel.Also are ecu flashed cars gonna have to be reflashed for this set up also.thanks

 

My guess at these questions:

1) Probably no unless your at a level that needs a new IC

2) definitly yes to harness the new air flow properly

(getting impressed with Burschur more and more every day) Terry S

 

Hmm, so the value of my BR440 on the used market has now dropped by, what? 30%? I understand you're trying to improve the products that you're bringing to the market but virtually every Buschur part I have purchased, while they perform well, has been superceded by a better part for less money.

Examples: BR Intake, BR Intercooler and now it seems the entire series of 1st generation BR turbos.

Oh well... I guess that's the price you pay to be an early adopter on such a "new" platform. Lesson learned.

 

The BR440 kit's performance is going to be on par with this, just for more money. Yes, it sucks for you, sucks worse for us. I have well over $15,000 invested in getting those manifolds done. Once this turbo hits the market that entire line of turbo kits will no longer be the top choice of what we recommend or what people want.

The BR intake you have actually looks better sitting in the car than the new style. The BR intercooler that we just released is also not better than the one you have. Yours is the best as it has shorter plumbing but you do have to modify the undertray to make it fit.

You have great parts, don't be depressed.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

Thanks for putting it in perspective from the standpoint of the capital investment that you've got into the casting of the manifold. No doubt there's some pain there. In the business I work in we're always trying to avoid "painting ourselves into a corner". When it does happen, I realize just how good I am at kicking myself in the ***.

Don't worry, I don't feel the parts I've currently have are bum parts. They do perform well. I probably had unrealistic expectations in terms of the resale value of the turbo specific parts. Fortunately I purchased the turbo and manifold very slightly used at a substantial discount so it's not like I'll take a bath if I decide to sell 'em and upgrade.

My only issue with the intercooler is the interference with the tow hook and the potential damage that can occur when it needs to be used. (Unfortunately I've need to use the tow hook) Aside from that, it's basically the last intercooler I'll ever need to buy.

 

David, back on page seven, you were offering 16g with the TI wheel (stock size) and the 10.5 housing for 9 something... I was assuming that this was just a more responsive, version of the turbo that comes stock. So I was under the assumption that not much would be needed in order to support this upgrade.

On the same note, my goal is better response, and a little bit more top end with a more usable power band. I'm not trying to be a dyno queen with big numbers. Just really usable numbers. The EVO in stock form is already a top contender, but stock is boring.

Maybe I'm approaching this the wrong way. but I was assuming that the Ti Aluminide hotwheel, stock cold wheel, 10.5 housing was essentially the same size as the stock turbo, just more responsive... If there's a completely different path you feel I should be taking, please point me in that direction. One thing I've learned about the EVO is that you can't just slap on random pieces here and there and expect to get the most out of it. Everything has to be planned out to get the most out parts installed...

 

Propellerhead,

I haven't found any used parts that really hold their value on the used market until they aren't made anymore. Then they sell for a premium. In that case the best thing I could do is stop the production of our turbo kits all together. The prices for the used ones would go through the roof. There was a time you could buy an HKS T4 manifold for the old DSM's for about $500, if you can find one now you will pay close to a $1,000 for it used. Same goes for the VPC's, use to be you could buy them new for $660 now a used one will cost you more than that.

DaGul,

Correct the standard turbo without the compressor wheel upgrade is $975. I thought you were asking about the 20G upgrade at first. While the titanium/aluminide wheel is lighter and should spool better the larger 10.5 housing I would imagine is going to have the reverse effect so my best guess is that turbo is not going to offer more low end than the stock unit, only more top end.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

I see... the lighter parts won't compensate for the lag induced by the larger 10.5 housing? So would the lag be even more pronounced if just the 10.5 housing was added to my stock turbo? So what would be a better upgrade path for better low end and a more usable mid range without sacrifice to top end?

 

10.5 housing lag would be minimal (500rpm).

You're best bet (everyone's best bet) will be the 20G - when Dave has completed it. It will have more lag than the 16G, but who gives a shirt when once boost comes on your neck will whiplash from the torque

This is gonna be better than sliced bread

 

The theory behind the titanium aluminide components is to offset the slight additional lag of the 10.5 housing.. Think about it this way, the 10.5 housing increses lag by about 200rpm (approx) the lightweight components reduce it back down by about 200rpm.. Its net effect is the spool is going to be about the same as stock.

Where the 10.5 housing excels is being able to provide stable boost through a higher RPM without it tapering. Additionally, adding a 20G wheel (and some porting or in my case a revised compressor housing) you then increase the air volume the turbo is capable of compressing.

Ultimately you end up with a turbocharger that retains a majority of the stock drivability characteristics, with more air volume at the same levels of boost, for a much longer duration. Isn't that the qualities we're all looking for?

Now, with that said, you can get the gains of one of the smaller turbo upgrades, designed for street duty, with few if any of the shortcomings of the bigger turbos. Add on that its a completely bolt-on swap. Though its not a good first mod, its a monster upgrade for a few hours of work, with what I'm hoping to be the same reliability as stock.

If you want a turbocharger that has better spool than stock with otherwise the same characteristics of the stock turbo, then the TD05HRA-16G6-9.8t is the turbo you want. This turbocharger was used on the Evo7 RS2 if I recall correctly. If you want even better spool but are willing to sacrifice upper rpm boost, then you can use the Evo 7 GT-A compressor housing or the TD05HR-16G6-9.0t (this turbo size would work REALLY well on a 1.5 liter honda engine)

In any case, Any of you guys who knows me, knows that I'm a HUGE fan of the stock twinscroll turbo, and have been waiting a YEAR to see this come together. I have aquired the parts necessary from all the twin scroll turbo revisions to built the best hybrid street turbo and have been anticipating this 20G wheel as the "last part" to finish this turbo..

What do I have?

Titanium CHRA from a TD05HRA-16G6-9.8t JDM turbo
05 Evolution MR Compressor cover (apparently the only new one available in the USA)
Evo 6.5 10.5t Turbine housing which will get buschur's porting if he sees fit to do it
JIC Twin scroll stainless header
DNP O2 housing
The Turbine housing, Header, and O2 housing will be ceramic/thermal coated (I'll have it done when Dave does my turbo)

And finally, Dave's very own 20G compressor wheel when it becomes available.

I predict that this combination will retain completely stock drivability, should be as reliable as stock, spool should be the same as stock on a 2.0L engine, but should flow enough air to work well with my stroker engine and worked head.

I believe in Buschur's products, and have had 2 generations of their exhausts and all of their staged components through stage4.

I think this is the absolute best direction to go in if your looking for a monster of a daily drivable car, without making the sacrifices that a huge turbocharger kit and ancillary parts would require.

The only difference in my philosophy is that I don't believe in standalones or speed density on a daily driven car. But thats just a personal preference and because I prefer to retain the federally required OBD-II components.

And you guys know how I am when I believe in something.. In my case its not about the money, ultimately all the components I've purchased cost around the same as the Buschur turbo kits. However I don't have to deal with losing the water cooled features of the turbo, the ability to swap parts in an emergency so I can get home, and I also want to prove that a smaller stock-ish turbo and retaining the stock ECU can get into the 10's and still function very well as a daily driver.

I don't care how many people say their GT35R turbo kits are great in daily driving until you REALLY drive the car in traffic for days at a time, for me there's just too many sacrifices, from drivability, oil cooling only, hacked oil feed lines and return lines, oil leaks, etc.. Break a part and your SOL on a long drive if you deviate too far from stock. With this route you can at least get to a mitsubishi dealer and pick up emergency parts if needed.