White Rabbit Real Deal 415awhp
Originally Posted by EVO8LTW
Different boost level, different fuel. It's not really an apples to apples comparison and the original poster hasn't tried to suggest that it is.
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
Nevertheless it is a bizzare set of facts
Also, 441 was without an airbox and the meth/93 car was supposedly a decntly conservative tune, not a tune for peak dyno numbers.
Originally Posted by atlvalet
I guess 122 octane fuel is better than 93 and meth? Also, the Switzer car had an upgraded actuator. Also, his car made 415 whp. The Switzer car had a test pipe? Is he running a test pipe? I don't know.
Also, 441 was without an airbox and the meth/93 car was supposedly a decntly conservative tune, not a tune for peak dyno numbers.
Also, 441 was without an airbox and the meth/93 car was supposedly a decntly conservative tune, not a tune for peak dyno numbers.
I wish I could find the post from the original WR thread that states that once tuners figure out how to tune this turbo it will be a blast. Well I am nobody when it comes to this stuff but I have felt a dramatic improvment with this turbo. Al and a lot of people haven't given this turbo a chance. This isn't the biggest turbo, and might not make the high hp numbers people are looking for, but what it does is hold boost a lot better in the higher rpm range and power comes on a lot stronger down low than the stocker could do.
I hope everyone didn't lose sight that the 441 Tym made was on race gas and 370 on pump. I am just a tad above thier pump gas numbers and I am still running fairly rich (10.5-10.7), also running 5.5 degrees of timing at peak torque to 21 degrees by redline, this is still very conservative in my books. Could I bump the timing and lean it out more? Sure can. Will I? Yup, once I get my wideband back in the car.
to be continued...
I hope everyone didn't lose sight that the 441 Tym made was on race gas and 370 on pump. I am just a tad above thier pump gas numbers and I am still running fairly rich (10.5-10.7), also running 5.5 degrees of timing at peak torque to 21 degrees by redline, this is still very conservative in my books. Could I bump the timing and lean it out more? Sure can. Will I? Yup, once I get my wideband back in the car.
to be continued...
Last edited by dryad001; Aug 3, 2005 at 06:30 PM.
Originally Posted by dryad001
I wish I could find the post from the original WR thread that states that once tuners figure out how to tune this turbo it will be a blast. Well I am nobody when it comes to this stuff but I have felt a dramatic improvment with this turbo. Al and a lot of people haven't given this turbo a chance. This isn't the biggest turbo, and might not make the high hp numbers people are looking for, but what it does is hold boost a lot better in the higher rpm range and power comes on a lot stronger down low than the stocker could do.
My only beef was with the original 441 whp dyno claim on a car without cams. Now that I see the same tuner making less whp with more mods it just re-enforces my original assumptions.
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
To clarify - I agree that the WR is a great unit and that it represents a nice value.
My only beef was with the original 441 whp dyno claim on a car without cams. Now that I see the same tuner making less whp with more mods it just re-enforces my original assumptions.
My only beef was with the original 441 whp dyno claim on a car without cams. Now that I see the same tuner making less whp with more mods it just re-enforces my original assumptions.
I understand what your saying. Believe me I still have unanswered questions with that 441 number, was it pushing the engine to it's limits? Was the engine fully heat soaked? Mod list right?
I didn't buy it because of the numbers i bought it because of the value. When I want a numbers car, Ill stop being lazy and finish up my new motor.
Originally Posted by MalibuJack
Sorry, Wasn't directed at you or anyone in particular..
Its just that the HP and TQ curves probably started around 2500rpm, ended at around 7500rpm, and crossed over at 5250rpm, so I was able to see what it looked like in my head and judge without caring that it was in MPH..
Its just that the HP and TQ curves probably started around 2500rpm, ended at around 7500rpm, and crossed over at 5250rpm, so I was able to see what it looked like in my head and judge without caring that it was in MPH..
Ok, so he is roughly making 400 awhp from 5250 rpm on up to 7500 rpm.
F ucking sweet. ( Evom community ) "Weak, peak numbers are where its at."
Tyms original run was on vp import for the 441, and 370 on pump, so looks just right to me. I think you stated Al that VP Import is oxygenated fuel that we can take off 5% right of the top because of this fuel, so it does seem to add up, not to mention this (black evil evo) car has a street every day tune and Tym was testing the outer limits with his car. JM2CENTS
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
To clarify - I agree that the WR is a great unit and that it represents a nice value.
My only beef was with the original 441 whp dyno claim on a car without cams. Now that I see the same tuner making less whp with more mods it just re-enforces my original assumptions.
My only beef was with the original 441 whp dyno claim on a car without cams. Now that I see the same tuner making less whp with more mods it just re-enforces my original assumptions.
Sorry, you're right.....
David,
You're absolutely correct, I was out of order when I posted this. My excuse is that even when someone posts great numbers, there is always someone that will find something to diminish them. Over 400 HP with a bolt on EVEN using alky is a pretty good thing. Some people scoff at the alky kit saying it's a crutch, but have no problem putting race gas in their car.... what's the difference?
It seems a better buy to me to put in 4 dollars worth of methanol and only have it being used when I'm boosting over 18 lbs...... not the whole way to the track and back.........
Sorry if I offended anyone, but it doesn't seem that anyone else is very sorry about offending the people that are willing to share their information with the rest of the community.......
Tony
Thats a change of character MR. Carretti, whats so bad about asking questions? This is the second best result and the same shop. Now if anyone has the trackrecord and experience its TS. Im not doubting Tym, FP, or any users but all this could be put to rest with some standardization of results.
You're absolutely correct, I was out of order when I posted this. My excuse is that even when someone posts great numbers, there is always someone that will find something to diminish them. Over 400 HP with a bolt on EVEN using alky is a pretty good thing. Some people scoff at the alky kit saying it's a crutch, but have no problem putting race gas in their car.... what's the difference?
It seems a better buy to me to put in 4 dollars worth of methanol and only have it being used when I'm boosting over 18 lbs...... not the whole way to the track and back.........
Sorry if I offended anyone, but it doesn't seem that anyone else is very sorry about offending the people that are willing to share their information with the rest of the community.......
Tony
Originally Posted by David@Vishnu
Thats a change of character MR. Carretti, whats so bad about asking questions? This is the second best result and the same shop. Now if anyone has the trackrecord and experience its TS. Im not doubting Tym, FP, or any users but all this could be put to rest with some standardization of results.
Very Well Put!!!!
Originally Posted by Rez90
being that i am usually one of the first to verbally crap on the WR....i thought i'd chime in.
the only negative thing i can say right now is when the WR came out these were the kind of numbers we were all looking for.....without alky injection....but we have all realized that a "magic" turbo really doesn't exist.
with that in mind....these #'s are great. not because of the peak (415). I have seen just recently basically the same setup with the stock turbo make 405whp. But the powerband....if you guys can see...it holds 400hp CLEAR to the redline which a stock turbo cannot. the other car i saw with the similar setup peaked 405 but the hp dropped off considerably. from 5k to 7k the car was making between 350 and 375 up to the redline. This is where i am assuming the WR will shine...not in the peak...but in the powerband......
i dont' know who the guy who started this thread....but kudo's to you. You are the first that has re-opened my eyes to why this really is considered an upgrade.
cheers
the only negative thing i can say right now is when the WR came out these were the kind of numbers we were all looking for.....without alky injection....but we have all realized that a "magic" turbo really doesn't exist.
with that in mind....these #'s are great. not because of the peak (415). I have seen just recently basically the same setup with the stock turbo make 405whp. But the powerband....if you guys can see...it holds 400hp CLEAR to the redline which a stock turbo cannot. the other car i saw with the similar setup peaked 405 but the hp dropped off considerably. from 5k to 7k the car was making between 350 and 375 up to the redline. This is where i am assuming the WR will shine...not in the peak...but in the powerband......
i dont' know who the guy who started this thread....but kudo's to you. You are the first that has re-opened my eyes to why this really is considered an upgrade.
cheers
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
Let me get this staight - on a car with no cams and no alcohol it makes 441 whp but on the same dyno with a full BR stage 4 and alcohol it makes only 400 ?
A stock turbo with alky and ems with supporting mods would also make around 400hp, I dont see the benefit, keep in mind, an alky equiped evo would have a longer torque curve also.