New BW EFR Turbo Thread
Aug 12, 2011, 12:31 PM
#631
I'm sorry John but i'd like to clear things up for all those looking as to not confuse and spread rumors....................but the preliminary #'s i posted were just that preliminary #'s as the boost pressure could not be raised past 32psi and so the pulls were ended very short only 7000ish when the motor can spin to upwards of 9000 rpm.
I was busy getting my car prep'd for some new mods yesterday and i'm not 100% that our tuner would like the prelim. graph out but i will do my best to get it up here but it's by no means close to being tuned at 100%
I was busy getting my car prep'd for some new mods yesterday and i'm not 100% that our tuner would like the prelim. graph out but i will do my best to get it up here but it's by no means close to being tuned at 100%
It would be like looking at a stock frame turbo chart and cutting it at 4500ish, of course the numbers going to read lower.
Aug 12, 2011, 04:00 PM
#633
"Much smaller"
In what regards?
The compressor exducer is 92.2mm compared to 94mm on the GT4294R. BW seems to measure backplate diameter and not tip diameter, it could easily be 94mm on the exducer with the extended tips?
It looks to be rated at 95 lb/min which puts it a hair under the 56-trim GTX4294R.
In what regards?
The compressor exducer is 92.2mm compared to 94mm on the GT4294R. BW seems to measure backplate diameter and not tip diameter, it could easily be 94mm on the exducer with the extended tips?
It looks to be rated at 95 lb/min which puts it a hair under the 56-trim GTX4294R.
67.5/94 on the compressor and 92 lbs min observed.
Then again the 3586 is at 75 lbs and I made 794 with that.
Aaron
Aug 12, 2011, 05:00 PM
#634
Geoff been great talking to you and again appreciate the info and all the help glad i posted this in here and made a good contact person in you for the future 
I personally can't wait to see what this and the 9180 turbos do in full tilt mode!
I'm sorry John but i'd like to clear things up for all those looking as to not confuse and spread rumors....................but the preliminary #'s i posted were just that preliminary #'s as the boost pressure could not be raised past 32psi and so the pulls were ended very short only 7000ish when the motor can spin to upwards of 9000 rpm.
FWIW on our MD a car making 550 HP in close to full weight will trap 135-140 mph
And that is more than often with higher boost pressures closer to 40psi
If this turbos stays on the car we have a couple of different options to help hold boost better up top we have been in contact with Geoff and will hopefully have some more #'s soon.
I was busy getting my car prep'd for some new mods yesterday and i'm not 100% that our tuner would like the prelim. graph out but i will do my best to get it up here but it's by no means close to being tuned at 100%
I personally can't wait to see what this and the 9180 turbos do in full tilt mode!
I'm sorry John but i'd like to clear things up for all those looking as to not confuse and spread rumors....................but the preliminary #'s i posted were just that preliminary #'s as the boost pressure could not be raised past 32psi and so the pulls were ended very short only 7000ish when the motor can spin to upwards of 9000 rpm.
FWIW on our MD a car making 550 HP in close to full weight will trap 135-140 mph
And that is more than often with higher boost pressures closer to 40psi
If this turbos stays on the car we have a couple of different options to help hold boost better up top we have been in contact with Geoff and will hopefully have some more #'s soon.
I was busy getting my car prep'd for some new mods yesterday and i'm not 100% that our tuner would like the prelim. graph out but i will do my best to get it up here but it's by no means close to being tuned at 100%
Aug 12, 2011, 05:54 PM
#635
I'M WORKING ON IT! 
Car is sitting on the dyno as i type as we are trying something out while we await a new actuator that will allow us to run more boost!
I'll be sure to stick around the shop to see if i can sneek at least a pic of the graph if things go well if not than unfortunately we'll have to wait until we get the new part in hand and installed.
Good news is that the turbo will be staying on the Evo so we will have full test results shortly
Car is sitting on the dyno as i type as we are trying something out while we await a new actuator that will allow us to run more boost!
I'll be sure to stick around the shop to see if i can sneek at least a pic of the graph if things go well if not than unfortunately we'll have to wait until we get the new part in hand and installed.
Good news is that the turbo will be staying on the Evo so we will have full test results shortly
Aug 12, 2011, 08:16 PM
#636
Well i tried my best to talk Sean into tuning longer but he has his son and wanted to get a head start on their weekend together 
So not much to update but on a good note we have figured out a way for it to hold more boost until the new actuator arrives.
Just did a quick test to 38 psi and that's when Sean called it a night.
My PEACE offering
So not much to update but on a good note we have figured out a way for it to hold more boost until the new actuator arrives.
Just did a quick test to 38 psi and that's when Sean called it a night.
My PEACE offering
Aug 13, 2011, 09:36 AM
#637
On the compressor side, the 52-trim GTX4294R is 67.8mm inducer and the 51-trim is 66.8mm which puts it very close in size to the 9180 on the compressor side. No idea on rated flow of those GTX wheels though.
The GT42R turbine is 75.1mm on the minor diameter where the EFR is 73.6mm, which could give it a few percent higher power capability provided they have similar flow for a given minor diameter.
Either way though, it would seem the 9180 was meant to be a competitor to the GT42R on power.
Originally Posted by BorgWarner EFR Turbochargers Technical Training Guide November 2010
The 80mm wheel really means business. Made from our highest-flowing blade shape, this wheel is designed for maximum flow in view of our highest-power EFR customers. This wheel has delivered the goods for up to 1000whp (per turbo) and comes with a 92% exducer trim.
Aug 14, 2011, 09:12 AM
#638
Evolved Member
Just read through this thread - some interesting opinions for sure!
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
I had a couple of EFR 8374’s on order since late last year, and understand the general frustration expressed by a few in this thread. I finally managed to get my hands on one a week before WTAC to run on my otherwise tarmac-rally spec IX. After reading through all the dire innuendo expressed in a couple of forums, I have to say, we approached tuning the car with some serious reservations. In fact, if time had permitted, I am pretty sure we would have probably reverted to running either my HKS T04z or TS GTX3582 instead.
Tuning the car for a few hours the night before the event, it made an easy 424kw atw at 2.0 bar, despite the fact it was tied down with 6 straps and running soft R’s on the rollers. For reference, the same car, on the same rollers, with the same target boost made 417kw atw running the T04z. Although peak power was comparable, what really surprised me was the relative power down low. At 4500rpm the 8374 was making ~70kw atw more power than the T04z, despite the car now running a 0.2ltr less displacement with the new bottom end.
We took the car to WTAC and flogged it for three days, and the turbo didn’t miss a beat. Ignoring the numbers, trackside the real benefit from the EFR is throttle response. With the T04z, in some short corners I used to left foot brake and get on the gas early to try and get the turbo spooling and get drive off the apex. Now, with the EFR’s responsiveness, not only is the “left foot spool” redundant, there are a couple of corners where I am short shifting and driving out on the much more lineal torque.
We will get back on the rollers later next week and refine the cam timing and balance of tune and then see how it performs at 2.5 bar. My view for what it is worth; product introduction and packaging issues aside, I can’t see why you would run anything else based on what I have seen to date.
SK
If so kudos to you guys for being able to hang with big boy and #4 fastest time of the whole day
Aug 19, 2011, 10:48 AM
#640
I'm back to update.
Well even with the new actuator from Geoff it still didn't do the trick unfortuantely
Geoff spoke to Sean yesterday and has a new spring being sent out to us so hopefully that will alleviate the issue and allow more than 40psi of boost.
Sean tried what he could but was only able to hold 35 psi and was not too thrilled with the boost plot so no graphs yet until he's happy with it.................it did make 590HP though
Well even with the new actuator from Geoff it still didn't do the trick unfortuantely
Geoff spoke to Sean yesterday and has a new spring being sent out to us so hopefully that will alleviate the issue and allow more than 40psi of boost.
Sean tried what he could but was only able to hold 35 psi and was not too thrilled with the boost plot so no graphs yet until he's happy with it.................it did make 590HP though
Aug 19, 2011, 10:51 AM
#641
hey patrick - i expected the new actuator that i sent you was too soft (it only had a 19psi spring in it) the big difference was it's a dual port, which is why you were able to hit 35psi on it. sean has it plumbed properly, and the new spring for the dual port canister is on its way
Aug 19, 2011, 11:51 AM
#642
hey patrick - i expected the new actuator that i sent you was too soft (it only had a 19psi spring in it) the big difference was it's a dual port, which is why you were able to hit 35psi on it. sean has it plumbed properly, and the new spring for the dual port canister is on its way
Glad you and Sean were able to speak to each other yesterday
I will update again when we have the new actuator installed and the car back on the dyno ....................
