I am totally convinced that Mitsu is coming back big time, Evo's, new Eclipses, all those Euro models coming out, new Rallye facility in Britain, new leadership, new everything...I think they just hit a big time road block since they are the last "Cast" type nippon company (Samurai's an'all) which now gets new wind, banks are throwing cash at it, etc.. I think Nissan had a ****e spell similar to theirs (somewhat similar). Anyway,...I think it's gonna be all good. ;-)

 

Anyone have more of what he is smokin'

 

Stock, ...I got some more of that positive thinking for ya, hehehe ;-). I just think these corp. giants somehow work it out and if not we got the most notorious street rockets Ever.

 

I was just going over the old postings as read that people took home "NEW" cars with over 100 miles on them. Well mine had 22 miles on it but two of them were tacked on after I got to the dealership. The Finance Manager took myself and my GF for a test drive where he drove...All we did is pull out the lot, about 200ft.or 30sec. with the car running, stomped on it, took it right to 6/6.5 rpms shifted and in seconed gear took it to the same rpms. He then told me what an "expierenced driver of turbos" he was, fliped a bi and did the same thing back to the dealership, pulled in and turned it off.

A "real" expierenced driver

I was dumb, still bought the car and now I get weird smells from the engine anywhere above 4.5 rpms.

If that was done at 20 miles I hate to see what went on for 99 miles...

 

okay so, if i race a bew Ralliart around the track, and they post my name and time on the webpage, but not the car, can i still get screwed? no right? because they cannot prove what i drove

 

Hey GP just curious - was the Evo paid or denied?

 

Take a look back at page 40 of this very thread.

 

 

Fellow EVO enthusiasts,

Yes, I took the time to go through all fourty+ pages of this thread. The one thing that still really sticks out in my mind about all of this, was this thread was started in June. Its not apparent that Mitsu. has responded to MSM_2K. This, agmonst the media articles and such, is the most disturbing piece of evidence avaliable. Perhaps we should drift the discussion of this thread towards a strong impression that Mitsu. SHOULD answer each and every question posed by MSM_2K?

As a personal opinion, I would like to stake a claim that there seems to be a terribly different corporate culture between the Asian parent company and MMNA. MMNA just seems to act very differently from other countries. Perhaps I'm in the "grass-is-always-greener-on-the-other-side." Could we have a few opinions from our UK, or Austrialian friends?

As the EVO came to the US, we got the 'best' Japan has to offer, but MMNA seems to really be botching it up. Another powerful example of this is the EVO has had to start to win 'private' races before MMNA goes ahead and spends one red cent to promote the EVO. The really good example of this is probably Vishnu's success in the One Lap of America. MMNA failed to realize the ulitmate potential of the EVO and how a little race help here and there would develop even a 'bigger' cult following.

The trend of MMNA not realizing the engineering proweress inside Mitsu. and that we don't 'really' have to have our 'own' different vehicles here in America has been going on for years. I remember really noticing this in like 1999, which is near the divorce from the 4G63 powered Eclipse, to the woes with the Montero, to not really producing a strong AWD lineup.

In fact I remember a Road and Track article or a Car and Driver article (I can't exactly remember) where the 'new' Toyota Celica, and the 'old' Acura Integra in 1999 or thereabouts creamed the 'new' Eclipse. Why? Because the 'new' Eclipse was built on the much heavier Galant chassis, but had less room than the Galant and the 'new' V6 was really a big pig for the 'new' Eclipse. It became yet another 'V6 Mustang-like' girly (sorry) show car. I remember the article specifically state that a LOT of DSM owners were VERY dissapointed that the 4G63 was taken from the states, and all the while the Lancer EVO was becoming world renowed in the WRC. Additionally, it was absolutely sick to see an Eclipse 'star' in 2 Fast 2 Furious alongside the EVO. Quite the sweet and sour movie. <laugh> About two years ago I was key helping a young college grad. friend and family (wife and little daughter) know that the Impreza was a 'better' car for the 'same' price as an Eclipse. They actually bought the WRX wagon, when he had been in 'multiple' test drives in the Eclipse.

MMNA, get a clue about what people really want in an automobile. Cush is not everything. Looks are NOT everything. The EVO 'looks' good because it performs good. The power of (racing) movement WILL sell cars. You can always take a 'sports' based car and turn it more 'plush.' (Look at BMW). But you can't necessarily take a 'plush' automobile and turn it into a thrill monster. The EVO is really the 'swiss-army' of sedans. Use that as a 'pattern' for future models, just as the Subaru has made a long list of Impreza chassis models. VW using the Audi A4 chassis, BMW using the three series chassis, Catillac (sp?) using the CTS-V platorm, Mazda with the three, five and six models ... shall I go on?

Rant over.

Cheers,

jcnel.

 

Disturbing yes, we all agree to that, but like 40+ pages of this thread have proven - the topic has been beaten on, gone OT (myself being guilty too) and the rest of what you have to see is beside the point.

Actually Mitsubishi (MMNA) was the title sponsor of the SCCA Pro Rally Championship in its inaugural year, in which the Evo dominated. They pulled out because of money concerns, which considering current events. I don't blame them. Its ridiculous to suggest they "botched up" promoting the car. The job has been done, everybody that needs to know about the car KNOWS about the car.

This is verrry funny. We have extremely unique cars here in America. The car you go on to malign, the Eclipse is a DSM borne product specifically for this market. The Endeavor is built on the Project AMERICA platform specifically and only for us. The new body style Galant is built on that platofrm for us by us. JDM Galant's still look like the last 8th generation design. Now,of course, you are going to go on to say something to the effect of those cars suck, AWD turbo Eclipses rule and that is a very common standpoint from the "enthusiasts" on sites such as these. What they don't realize is that those three vehicles (and the Lancer) make up Mitsubishi's core market and are very import for its survival. Depending on which reports you read turbo DSM's made up anywhere from 5 to 15% of TOTAL sales. That means the vast majority of the cars were NA FWD sold to "little girly types" that didn't want a V6 Mustang! The third generation Eclipse is the BEST SELLING Eclipse in HISTORY. Eclipses have ALWAYS been on Galant platforms. My two cars can share powertrains and suspension parts quite easily. 1G eclipses go with 6G's(Galant VR-4). And the next Eclipse will be the same way - built on the Project America platform. Handling may have suffered yes, but Galant handling just means a bigger and heavier car each time a new generation comes out. The formula has worked because the car has put the Prelude, Cougar, and Celica out of business. It probably helped put the Cambird down, wooing in buyers of "girly V6 models." It has also outsold the Integra and RSX and Tiburon. The Eclipse may not wow the perofrmance enthusiasts anymore, but it makes the girly types happy and they are the ones with the money. What a shocker, you helped a man with a family pick a four door wagon over a 2+2 coupe with a tiny back seat. Amazing. Even without the turbo and AWD that's a no-brainer decision.
All the DSM owners that complain probably didn't buy their cars brand new and thusly have no right to ***** about Mitsubishi moving on to cater to a more lucrative market. Mitsubishi takes a three year hiatus from the turbo AWD market (2000, 2001, 2002), come back with an even better car - EVO>GSX, and people like you say they are not looking after their fan base.

Unbelievable.

Why not pick on Toyota? No Supra, no Celica (after this year) no All-Trac turbo. No turbos, period.
Or Nissan? No Sylvias, No Skylines, no turbos. No son of Godzilla Pulsar AWDs.
Mazda is showing signs of life but still no rotary turbo, no 323GTX AWD turbo.
Honda doesn't even try. And despite Mitsubishi's woes and everyone claiming Subaru "does it right." - they still don't sell more cars then Mitsu.

Does the grass still seem greener on the other side?

 

We should give GPTourer admin priv. for this thread. He's quite worked up on 'anything' that comes through on this thread. As scathing as his response was, I liked it. .

In response to the statement about MMNA sponsoring SCCA ProRally, I beg the question that such an act was Japan sponsored 'through' MMNA, or MMNA sponsored without Asian input? Not much evidence is given in that area, we both have good points, based on that idea.

Your statement as quoted: "All the DSM owners that complain probably didn't buy their cars brand new and thusly have no right to ***** about Mitsubishi moving on to cater to a more lucrative market. Mitsubishi takes a three year hiatus from the turbo AWD market (2000, 2001, 2002), come back with an even better car - EVO>GSX, and people like you say they are not looking after their fan base."
...
This does not address the idea that MMNA 'may' not have been the deciding factor in bringing over the EVO. It is not a 'strong' comeback in my opinion because the EVO was already dominating in the rest of the world. Don't get my wrong, personally, I'm glad its here, I bought one and love it. As far as MMNA's support of the EVO? Well this is what this thread is really saying. Some evidence to this idea is the relative 'lack' of accessories I see for the EVO. All the accessories are either 'easy' for MMNA to make / get like 'race-pedals' etc ..., or come from the relatively compatiable USDM Lancer. So, where are my mudflaps? They are such an easy item to produce, but I don't see MMNA jumping to the 'consumer's' cause.

On that 'same' idea, Mitsu. has been a 'follower' in the market. They 'moved' in the market, rather than making the market lucrative for itself. Instead of expounding on what brought them fame and fourtune (which in my mind was the robust 4G63 + turbo and the fledgling AWD market ... aka Subaru-like AWD), they 'headed' off in a diff. direction, producing sub-par V6 models, aka V6 Eclipse. Some history on this turbo stuff was the old Mitsu. powered turbo LeBaron, the Dodge Caravan turbo, the Sprint Turbo, the Eclipse, the 3000GT. No matter how you cut it, that Mitsu. turbo market died, and if it wasn't for the Asian and strong Europe based EVO, we would have NEVER seen the 4G63 back here in America. I digress.

Regardless, I'm still pushing that Mitsu. should respond to MSM_2K's questions. As much as I can be 'right' or 'wrong' on any one issue in this thread I don't feel I should respond as to my feelings about MMNA any longer here.

Flame suit on and locked shut.

0.02

Cheers,

jcnel.

 

Wow, you thought that was scathing? I thought I'd toned it down quite a bit. I'm trying to be a kinder, gentler GPTourer. I guess its because I just totally don't agree and see things from a unique perspective that's completely alien to 99.9% of the people on this board.

Whether it was MMC sponsoring the Evo through MMNA what does it matter? The end result is the car got heavy sponsorship at its launch. ASFAIK, it was MMNA's decision to pull the plug i.e. Finbarr said cut it. So that means it came out of MMNA's ad money to be the title sponsor in the SCCA. He can't decide to pull out of WRC, because that would be above his head and up to the motherland.

I'm a subscriber to Super Street, Modified, Import Tuner and Sport Compact Car, and I'd have to say that out of the past year there's been an Evo on the cover at least one out of the four virtually every month. The Evo is the media darling, Mitsu couldn't buy the coverage the Evo is getting. I think I've seen an STi on a cover like, twice.

You can scream turbos all you like but they just aren't ready for the mainstream. The costs of production and maintenance kept Mitsubishi from being competitive and profitable in the mid 90's. Now, they are claiming they want to return to that more technically advanced market. So we will just have to wait and see.

The V6 Eclipse is a great car, it does it job very well and is a better choice for casually drivers wanting a torquey engine with an automatic (what most sporty car buyers want) compared to the peaky 4cyls of its competitors that you can ONLY get with manual 6 speeds. The car isn't for you or me, but that doesn't mean it is subpar.

It doesn't matter whether it was MMNA's idea to bring it over or not. The point is they are a wholly owned subsidary of MMC, what's the point? Millions were spent federalizing the car of the U.S. Market, Finbarr was excited about the MR saying "There is still a lot to do with the Evo" [for us/our market.]

Mitsubishi a follower? What other turbo AWD coupe has there EVER been? (Oh yeah Toyota's 2 year run with the All-trac in around 1990, compared to 10 years of turbo AWD DSMs) 6cyl TT AWD? The 3000GT VR4 covered it with no Skyline from Nissan. Subura has just now come into the market (2002) or was it '01? with the WRX, and STi and for once Mitsu had to "counter" or follow with the Evo, and its a better car - not an also ran.

 

Not so my friend. The $hit falls from above!

News from the Associated Press today (14-Jun-2004)
"TOKYO - Police on Monday raided the home of the former president of Mitsubishi Motors Corp., who was arrested last week on suspicion of hiding auto defects." Here's the link to a couple of related articles:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5207688/
http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106...43a6026,00.html

Local dealer called me in to see the MR yesterday and was probing me about if I was into to racing from the moment I set foot in the building - swear to god.

saying "You Evo guys all seem to know each other and get together once or twice a month to race right?"

I wanted to ask if he was trying to void my warranty before I even bought the f*@#ing car. But I held my tongue.

I still can't believe it.

 

It's been a LONG time since I last visted evolutionm. Here's a quick update:
- In a follow up directly with Mitsubishi, they hooked me up with the company that handles dispute resolution. I don't have a date scheduled yet, but at least I'm dealing with more than a post office box ... FINALLY.
- Evo is running great with no issues. Since the warranty was already "restricted" (read that voided ), my son has been auto-xing the car. Not only that, we both participated in our first HPDE track event a couple of weeks ago at the Spring Mountain track in Pahrump Nevada.

Here's a pic of my son in the Evo:


Here's a pic of me in the S2K:


It's interesting how the Evo -- with the new motor, broken in by us not the dealer -- has not experienced ANY issues with significantly more auto-x and track time on it. At the track we ended up with about 12 hours of seat time over two days. Contrast that with the 6 minutes of auto-x in a parking lot that MMNA used as an excuse to not to honor the warranty.

I'm convinced that the motor failure is more likely related to abuse by the dealer (I like the post on the previous page about the test drive experience with the dealer! ) than to the 6 minutes of auto-x after the car had 3,000 miles on it. I'm convinced that the Evo is a great car.

I am, however, also convinced that MMNA will do anything it can to avoid honoring "... the best backed warranty". Evo is an exceptional car. Unfortunately, the company is a mess and completely willing to ***** <sorry for the language, but it's appropriate> the customer.

I like the new MR ... I'd buy another Evo if they came with a warranty that was worth anything ... sadly that doesn't seem to be the case.

-Michael

 

I'm glad that you are finally getting to enjoy the car. Good luck with the resolution on the previous issue. BTW car looks great, Have you lowered it or is it just because of the corner that it looks lowered???