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Intermittent Starting Problems - Mysterious Cause Identified and Fixed
Evo GeneralDiscuss any generalized technical Evo related topics that may not fit into the other forums.
Please do not post tech and rumor threads here.
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It doesn't matter if you hear the relay click. It probably isn't the relay itself, but the reality that there isn't enough current going through it to actuate the starter solenoid. Jumping BAT + to the starter relay pin #5 terminal answers that question definitively.
I'm not in a position to get a pic, but when you remove the starter relay, you will see 5 pins, 3 across, and two down. Pin 5 is the bottom. Go to post #128 and look at the diagram of connector B-07X, and you will understand.
car started right up with jumping the +bat and pin #5. whats weird is that after jumping, I turned the car off and tried to start the car normally with out jumping pin #5 and the car started. what gives? total head scratcher. I ordered a relay and a ignition switch. hopefully this problem does now arise again. I had purchased my evo back in 06 brand new and so far she's been running like a champ. this is the first issue I've had with her so far. So glad i found your thread Ted. Thanks again.
Does this diagram show the principal of the HD relay? As a update. I went to change the starter relay and ignition switch today. , no luck. car does not start. I'm assuming now that the insufficient power is the culprit. Next step is to install the HD relay as prescribed. hope this will solve my problem.
I've been meaning to update this thread for a while now and finally found a few mins free. First - Another Huge Thank You to TedB and everyone who contributed to this thread
Well, since my last post, the car has once again started doing the random no-start! Using a mini jump box usually got the car running again - Hugely irritating for a daily driven car.
Things I tried since those posts:
I swapped in a new starter, the issue dissapeared for a few months but then came back!
I replaced the battery (I run a AGM Miata battery) again the symptom went away for a month and then came back!
At this point every starting related component in my car has been replaced and I've inspected/cleaned every connector involved! <well poo now what?>
Last month I finally did the relay rewire mod TedB designed (posts #131 and #148) So far so good the car has not repeated the symptom.
My IX had 2 wires as detailed in post #204 I cut both wires and soldered the relay wires between them. To help keep everything neat, tidy AND in an accessible location; I drilled a hole in the bottom of the relay case to run the wires through. Here is how mine turned out:
Last edited by JohnnyTSi; Sep 15, 2017 at 04:38 PM.
Reason: kant spel
Well done. The important things to take away from this discussion is when turning the key fails to engage the starter, two possible culprits are (a), rotating starter switch, and (b), weak factory circuit unable to engage the starter solenoid for various reasons.
To update my own experience, since securing my starter switch with zip ties and installing an aftermarket starter relay as described throughout this discussion, my starter issues have become a thing of the past.
Figured I'd bump this rather than make a new thread.
Pardon my ignorance, but what kind of connector do you use to make this jumper cable you're using? Also, just to make sure I'm correct on this, it goes from the battery + to here?:
No, careful. B+ from the battery is wired to pin 30 of the new relay that you're installing and nowhere else.
When I cut that Blk/Red wire from the factory relay, the lead from the factory relay socket gets wired to pin 85 of the new relay, and the other end gets wired to pin 87 of the new relay. All you're doing is using the factory starting system to trigger the new relay. When you turn the key to "start," power will flow from the factory relay to pin 85 of the new relay. That will complete the connection between the B+ at pin 30 of the new relay and pin 87 of the new relay (Blk/Red to starter solenoid). When cutting that Blk/Red wire and making the new connections, I soldered the new connections so they would be absolutely solid, and weatherproofed them with shrink tubing.
No, careful. B+ from the battery is wired to pin 30 of the new relay that you're installing and nowhere else.
When I cut that Blk/Red wire from the factory relay, the lead from the factory relay socket gets wired to pin 85 of the new relay, and the other end gets wired to pin 87 of the new relay. All you're doing is using the factory starting system to trigger the new relay. When you turn the key to "start," power will flow from the factory relay to pin 85 of the new relay. That will complete the connection between the B+ at pin 30 of the new relay and pin 87 of the new relay (Blk/Red to starter solenoid). When cutting that Blk/Red wire and making the new connections, I soldered the new connections so they would be absolutely solid, and weatherproofed them with shrink tubing.
Yeah, I'll be attempting the relay install hopefully soon, but I wanted to test it with your jumper wire that you mentioned in this post:
Originally Posted by Ted B
Bypass the starter relay, and I'll bet it cranks every time. See post #50 for location. Jump the positive battery terminal to pin 5 socket, and it should crank. If it doesn't crank, your solenoid wire is shot or has a bad connection at the solenoid. If it cranks, either the starter relay is shot, or you don't have enough juice to activate the solenoid. If that turns out to be the case, I believe I have a fix.]
My question is what kind of connector should I use for a jumper cable to connect to pin 5 socket, and is where I marked the correct spot? Or am I more confused than I even know? I've never had to anything like this, so it's very possible,
...when you remove the starter relay, you will see 5 pins, 3 across, and two down. Pin 5 is the bottom. Go to post #128 and look at the diagram of connector B-07X, and you will understand.
So yes, the one you've circled should be the pin #5. I just used a piece of decent sized (e.g. 16awg or larger) wire to jump it. Be sure you do not have the car in gear when you test it!
So yes, the one you've circled should be the pin #5. I just used a piece of decent sized (e.g. 16awg or larger) wire to jump it. Be sure you do not have the car in gear when you test it!
Perfect, thank you. Last question (hopefully)... do I need to put any type of connector on that wire?
My intermittent starting problem finally got so bad that it was causing me to get stuck for more than a few minutes, so I finally made the repair with a new ignition switch, Part No: MN113754 ($39.97, delivered, from ebay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/262625615924)
And now i'm kicking myself for waiting so long... here's the list of things this one repair fixed:
Problem of car not starting every time is now gone.
Problem of all three center diff lights staying lit after startup is now gone.
Problem of wild bucking at WOT is now gone.
Problem of a nasty pop! under the hood under harder boost is now gone (probably different symptom of same problem of bucking)
Problem of ABS light intermittently coming on is gone.
Problem of Battery light flashing on and off is gone.
Problem of wavering Idle is much lessoned, although not eliminated.
Anyone with any of these problems might want to just swap this part out and see what happens.
Aug 4, 2017, 05:41 PM
