I don't dodge your questions, you dodge my answers

http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/ca...h-revving-hero

http://www.vividracing.com/catalog/r...-p-101712.html

http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/up...-mazda-rx-8-r3

And that's just talking about RWD cars. Since the car is under 200 hp it could be argued FWD or RWD doesn't even matter, and that brings in a whole slew of other light weight options (Civic SI, Cooper S, 500 Abarth).

Anyway, you just basically admitted to wanting the car because it's a Toyota. I personally don't think there's anything wrong with that, we all follow our favorite brands. As I said repeatedly, if you care about the Toyota badge, it makes perfect sense to choose this over the Miata. I'm sure it will be a great Miata competitor.

 

This car hasn't been available for two years AND costs $35K. That is a helluva lot more money. I don't consider that affordable.

I don't want an aftermarket hardtop. I want a coupe. Plus I like the idea, as useless as you may think it is, of having a back seat. The engineers at Subaru and Toyota both were quoted saying that a set of track tires can fit in the back of the car with the rear seat folded down. You can't do that in a Miata.

Again, this is a four door, and more expensive, and heavier, and has a piece of junk rotary that gets 13 mpg's. There is a reason no one buys these.

Ok, hold the phone. FWD or RWD doesn't matter?? Really? Have you never owned a RWD car? Do you not understand the very different dynamics that a RWD car possesses vs. FWD? It's now clear to me that you have no idea what you are talking about. Can you do this in a civic?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK2EwymH9oY&t=0m56s

You read what you wanted to hear and are completely wrong. I like this car for what it is, regardless of brand. In fact, I'd be more inclined to get the Subaru version because of the higher interior trim level.

 

Eh, forgive my bluntness, but you have to realize that you are arguing an opinion. I know that logically there are other options out there. I am just excited about this one. That is all. I just don't understand the argument. It looks like a good car.

I feel the same way about this as I have about every M5 that has come down the road. Sure, there are a barrage of other options out there. Everyone has a preference. I just love that car. I couldn't put my finger on why. I just do.

 

Of course you post a video of e brake drifiting on a wet track.

As a matter of fact, yes you can do that in any car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQMQkMvRG3I

And don't forget, e brake drifting is much different then power sliding. While you might be able to do some weak drifts with this car, you will never be able to power slide due to being so under powered.

Not that I care about either, because real drivers don't really do either.

 

Huh? I'm really starting to agree with NFS on his analysis of you. Plenty of "real" drivers have commented how much they like this car. What do you call people who are making a living driving and reviewing cars, "fake" drivers? Plenty of reviewers have commented how easy it is to get the back end out without the e-brake or clutch, you can toss it in and power slide using *gasp* the throttle pedal. You really should read the reviews before you go spouting BS that is factually incorrect and just makes you look like the jackass NFS described.

 

I was talking about drifting specifically. Real drivers don't do it just means it's not generally the fastest way around a corner. And plenty of FWD cars can do similar things.

 

It's comments like that are just ignorant and again you are getting entirely too defensive over a car you can't drive yet. Big surprise, ambystom01 calls me a jackass too

If you read what Im saying, my only point is that the 86/BRZ/FRS will be at beat a great Miata competitor. I don't know why that is bothering you so much. I've already said many times it's probably going to be a good car, but in my opinion you need to stop pretending Toyota is inventing anything new here.

And "I don't want an aftermarket hard top" is the lamest excuse not to consider a Miata I've never heard.

 

Looks like a rx8

 

I have a Miata and a hard top is not the same. A coupe will be stiffer.

The fact you're discussing Civics "drifting" makes me think you just don't get this car and really have no desire to get the car.

 

What exactly is that based on? Have you driven an S2000? It is stiffer then many coupes, and I bet an AP1 or CR S2000 will be much stiffer then the FRS. Again, since you can't drive the car you have zero basis of comparison.

The fact you keep replying with these one liners shows you have no interest in contributing anything to the discussion except petty vacuous comments.

 

A coupe will always be stiffer than a convertible for a given weight, unless we start taking into account supercars that use insanely rigid and complex setups.

Seriously, what is the point of these comments? To show how bad a car is that you've never driven and every reviewer says is great? To make people realize they should just buy an Evo instead?

 

Except we aren't comparing a FRS coupe with a FRS convertible, we're comparing across cars between a Miata and a FRS coupe, so your example is meaningless.

My only point was that I felt people are hyping this car up, and that there are plenty of options on the market now and the in past which do the same things - cheaper, faster, and lighter.

There really isn't much to talk about until we can all personally test drive it. Your "pre production limited access behind closed doors" reviews are mostly positive, but that means nothing to me and I'd recommend taking them with a grain of salt. At least until an official price is announced, and maybe we see some actual comparison tests with things like the Miata, RX-8, etc.

That's all.

 

second that!

 

What the **** are you talking about? You were at some point trying to argue this

Thus my statement is right on topic. A convertible is not the same as a coupe. That is fairly simple to understand concept. One of those reasons is because of rigidity. A coupe will be stiffer than a convertible all else being equal. Some people also simply don't want a convertible for other, subjective reasons.

 

*Gasp* Did you even watch the video!? There was no e-brake being pulled.

I'm well aware of both scenarios. As others have said, read ANY, and I mean ANY of the reviews posted and every single person says the car can kick the tail out with throttle induced over steer. I know you didn't even care to read those reviews because your only role in this thread is to stir the pot.

Anyways, the point is that a RWD car that you can flick around and get tail happy with, even though not being the fastest way around the track, is in fact, a much more rewarding drive than an under steering wrong wheel drive car. That is my opinion anyways.

And I gave you TWO of several reasons a Miata doesn't appeal to me. From a drivers car stand point, I think they are great. I'd just never own one. Convertible two seater is too impractical. In a pinch I could throw my kids in the back of an FR-S if I needed to. Want more reasons?