Since the other thread got closed instead of getting cleaned, I'll move my questions to here. What kind of affect would a leaky BOV have on a tune? Could a leaky BOV have been the power robbing culprit? Was the 1G BOV crushed?

 

I don't get it...
I think it's the tune that makes teh difference. Why does it has to do with dyno tune and road tune? I am sure the better mid range power has to do with the tuning, I am sure of a more timing advance and the much leaner AFR contribute to it. But these can be done even with road tuning right?

For the AFR, I just don't believe in the AFR reading from the dyno using at the tailpipe. It's because I have a cat on, and it makes a difference if reading from the tailpipe. That's why I like road tune... but I put so many hours in tuning my own car. I know the tuner can't spend hundred hours to tune someone's car on the road, but if a tune has the time, I think road tuning can be better, so it is tuned for the real world condition, including weather and load. If time is a problem, isn't it best to tune on dyno for WOT runs, and then check it again on the road for drivability and tuning the many other load sites that can't be done on the dyno?

Ok... flame on!

 

A leaky BOV could have devastating effect.

I personally have the 1 Gen BOV on my car, the spring is really strong, the valve does not open easily . I am not saying that the BOV could be faulty either, that is possible. I am more focused into the actual clamps itself, they are tough to tighten and you MUST HAVE the proper tool to tighten them as they will not hold tight unless you tightened strong.

I had ran my car both ways, with the 1gen bov venting to the atmosphere and with the BOV recirculating, definately the Buschur BOV offered on their UICP MUST BE recirculating otherwise the valve gets stuck partially open making your car basiclly undriveable at the midrange rpm.

There are many clamps to be tightened and the access to them sometimes is not easy, as I mentioned before, if you don't have the proper tools and you do the job"half way" it will leak.

 

here is one of the main problems i have with the original tune. The nine comes with an all metal diverter valve which is more than adequate with the boost levels achieved during the tune. The owner was sold a 1g unit which may be a nice piece but is completely unecessary. Also with the reflash boost is completely controllable via the stock ecu. Again i feel the sale of a manual boost controller is unecessary and eliminates the great controls a factory solenoid can provide at these boost levels. Dave buschur himself has recently begun singing the praises of ecu controlled boost via the aem.

 

Isn't a dyno machine a "rolling" road anyway? I see the car strapped down, and the wheels moving. isn't a road tune, a dyno tune without the straps? I could care less about the HP readings on a dyno machine, I am all about the TUNE!

That was a nice jesture Steve (SuperHatch,) (to Luis), He really is a helpful and nice guy. And has gone over and above to help me out!

 

Bingo! The point that Shiv is trying to make, and Chris reiterated is that all these extra parts are not needed to make significant power from the Evo IX or VIII. Why was it, back in the day, me and Smogrunner with Stock air boxes, stock intercoolers;and piping,with no MBC running better times than the BR Stage 4s in SoCal. All u need for an air box upgrade is a free flowing filter and the stock intercooler is all good up to 400 whp. Why change and spend money if u don't have to.

 

The point is Kevin, one cannot draw a dyno graph in their head just by feeling a 3rd gear pull. And since the dyno chart cannot be looked at graphically, its hard to figure out EXACTLY where improvements can be made. I would imagine that this is why Al uses his Gtech pro thingy mcjigger. However the problem with those types of devices is that they cannot account for bumps or dips in the road, or wind speed changes. So when you see dips in the graph you have to ask yourself, was that really a knock event? Did I really pick up power here, or was that just a bump where the car was unloaded for a sec? With tuning, one is looking for trends, and trends are impossible to spot when there is no constant load held...I don't care who you are.

 

So I see Shiv does not like road tunes. Then I see another vendor say way to go Shiv but he too gives road tunes.

 

Ultimately the ideal "tune" would be conducted on a dyno and then logged on the street or track and fine tuned again... correct?

 

Since the thread in the other forum got closed (grrr), if figure I'll post up some additional info here.

1) Dave Buschur pointed out that there was some gap in the displayed runs and insinuated that I was up to no good. Well.. here are the first 8 runs:

Run #3 (brown) was the low power one that I aborted earlier because the car pinged right off the bat and pulled lots of timing. I didn't think it was fair to Al for me to post this result since it appeare to be an outliner. Run #6 (blue) was my first run with my base flash. I aborted it earlier be cause boost jumped up to 25psi.

2) Regarding the inevitable boost leak claim, there are few things that one should be aware of.

First, a boost leak is essentially mechanical failure. One that will vary from run-to-run and condition-to-condition. Anyone who has ever tried to chase down a loose hoseclamp/slipped couplper will attest ot that. A car with a boost leak will not generate 100% consistent boost logs, run after run after run. Here are the back to back boost logs for the car as it came to our shop:

Does that look like a boost leak to you?

3) Also regarding boost leak claim, any such leak will play havok with calculated load and result in erratic AFR readings. This is because the leaking air is still be read by the MAF and the system is fueled accordingly. Anyone who has tuned a car with a boost leak will also be aware of this. Here are the back-to-back AFR logs of the car as it came to our shop:


And here's the AFR from 2 weeks ago as tested by Gruppe S. It is virtually identical:

And while, we're at it, here is the dyno result from Gruppe S. It is virtually identical:


There is no leak. This is fact. No amount of internet debate change change that.

-shiv

 

Probably because he doesn't have a dyno in his garage Like he said, he can constantly monitor and tweak - day after day etc.... Kinda what Shiv was eluding to with why a Tuner cannot get a lot of repetition (repeatability) from a customers car & and perform a tune in an hour

 

Better yet let "Dynochart Man" Smogrunner pull up some old Dynoflash graphs from a local shop in his hood. The results do not improve Al's position as I can attest. There is alot of empiracal evidence, that can be revealed, that would not paint a pretty picture for Al's "Butt Dyno" tooning methods.

 

This isn't the kind of answer I was looking for. Can anyone quanitifiably answer the first question?....

What kind of affect would a leaky BOV have on a tune? Will it show in the AFR or boost graphs? Will it cause the temperature of the air entering the cylinders to be elevated?

 

I don't even know who this Jim Patterson guys is. He's not on our computers, AFAIK.

 

Al was all over my *** in that thread right before xmas. I was professional and level headed the whole time he was having a hissy fit about it.

Oh well.