You guys are freaking me out with this "no water hooked up on a ball bearing turbo" talk! This is a REALLY bad idea on something like a GT35R. The turbo has to be cooled by something, either water or oil. On a non ball bearing turbo there is a relatively large amount of oil going through the center section which serves to cool things down. However, on a Garrett ball bearing turbo like a GT30R, GT35R, etc. the oil inlet fitting has a restrictor in it. There is a very small amount of oil actually making it through the center section. It is fine in terms of lubrication because the ball bearings don't require nearly as much oil as the journal bearings, but there is not nearly enough flow to manage heat removal.

Now on other turbos, like the non ball bearing SCxx turbos, you can get a water cooled center section and in that case I would agree that the water cooling is optional. You still have the large flow of oil because of the normal bearing system, so running water through it would just provide extra cooling capacity in road race applications, etc.

 

Dave has mentioned in his 20glt thread that this new 50trim turbo he is trying is a borg warner extended tip turbo. This might be a realy good performer. I have had my eye on this turbo for months and was actually tempted to make a kit and try this guy myself. Here is a quote from the bullseye forums. A guy there tested this extended tip turbo (s200) against the garrett 50 trim and here is what he posted::::

well ive been testing this turbo out for a month or so, and this is what i have come up with. comparing garrett 50 trim to the s200

full boost
garrett 3700 rpms
s200 3000 rpms

hp at 21 psi
garrett 317
s200 339

ft lbs
garrett 330
s200 339


the s200 at 22 psi i got 356 hp and 366 ft lbs. the best thing about this turbo is im hitting full boost alot faster so im gaining alot of midrange power. we had another srt 4 on the dyno and he was using the gt3071r and he was hitting full boost at 3200rpms and he made about 320hp. so the s200 makes more power and faster spool than a 3071r.

 

Any new info????

 

Ahaaaa, and I bet it would still make her come faster

 

Ha ha, someone has an itch. We'll see how long that sig of yours lasts.

 

anxious!!!!!!

 

Not that I don't believe you, and I do know you used to have a AMS GT3076R Turbo kit, but how in gods name would an old Non BB Turbo spool faster? Especially one that probably flows more boost then a traditional 50 Trim? This spool numbers would be quite slower on the Evo I would believe being a 2.0.


Also, before Evolutionm, my Mecha was DSM Talk, check this out.

http://www.dsmtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144980

 

and some more info.....

http://www.bullseyepower.com/index.php

I believe it has something to do with "Extended tip"?

I believe we may have a hit on our hands, 500WHP, I am looking for 450WHP Pump gas on my IX

It seems 30PSI is the max for thsi turbo and about 550WHP.

The S200 turbocharger was tested on a well-supported 1998 Acura Integra that previously sported a T67. In this dramatic comparison, it is clear to see that the S200 was not only able to safely run a higher boost level, but also spooled much quicker to that higher boost level, creating much more usable power that began at lower RPM.

While the S200 was able to safely run up to 32 psi, this chart shows an S200 at an efficient 30 psi pull compared to the T67's maximum efficient boost level of 25 psi. The tune for the S200 only differed from the T67 tune by adjusting AFRs where needed to maintain a safe ratio.


Total area under the curves show the true performance potential and it cannot be any more clear that the S200 produced a huge increase in area under the curves. The shaded areas of the chart show gains afforded by the S200 over the T67. Looking at the chart, both the horsepower and torque curves of the S200 are much higher across nearly the entire power band.

There is a gain of 100 wheel HP at the point where full boost is reached. Likewise, there is a gain of nearly 80 wheel torque at the point of full boost. The increases in extra power and torque begin immediately upon getting into boost, which is noticeably earlier as seen by the S200 curves being further to the left than those of the T67. The S200 maintains more power and torque nearly everywhere in the power band. As can clearly be seen, the T67 cannot come close to the S200 levels until near redline!

Compared to a T67, the S200:

* Runs higher boost safely and more efficiently
* Spools quicker
* Produced up to 100 WHP and 80 WTQ more
* Maintains higher levels of power and torque a full 3000 RPM longer



I believe it was Dave who touted "It's the area under the curve that counts"

I really believe we have a winner, I am truely excited Dave, test one on an IX please

 

now maybe everyone can understand. the highest HP number is not that big of a deal. yea sure, it is nice to have a high number, but it is the "area under the curve that counts!"

thanks for the post High PSI.

 

the s200 turbo does look promising.

 

http://www.bullseyepower.com/s200.htm

here is a little write up on it

but this turbo is internaly gated isnt it? i dont like that part.

 

So after 11 pages of getting crap this is starting to look like a good idea? haha

Also, as of yesterday I have arranged to have BB 50 trims built. Nice, right?! Let the flaming begin.

I am still continuing this ET 50trim, the car is getting here for it Friday.

The BB 50 trim kit is going to be identical to our GT30 and GT35R kits with our manifold, watercooled, ballbearing etc kits. I am going to try to use a 38 mm gate on it though to help drop the price of the kit, that will knock off $100+ from the cost. Also I am hoping with the smaller compressor cover the stock fan will work, that will knock off $100. Going to look at some other ways to knock some money down on the kit and I am HOPING I can do a real 50 trim, the 49 lb/mn kit for less than $2795.

 

The crowd is fickle Sir Buschur, the crowd is fickle...

Hope that does not mean you are going to pursue this other avenue though!

I have to admit I find the Schwitzer/Borg Warner turbo above REAL interesting too! I'd be willing to bet adding it to a Buschur kit would be worth a few ponies Yes, yes, I'm still a water jacket boy, but interesting none the least!

 

I could have sworn I just posted this.


Hey Dave, from what I posted, doesn't this S200 out perform a 49 pound BB 50Trim? I am really excited about that spool characteristic and am wondering if this turbo you are using would somehow be superior.

Also if you used a smaller housing, wouldn't that lower the efficiency?

What is your take on the GT30R's? I have yet to see a GT30R outperform a 50 Trim anywhere except on paper.

 

hey dave, sent you a PM. can't wait till next week!