Lancer Evolution XI goes hybrid [merge]
Why doesn't Mitsubishi and subaru make the Evo and STI smaller and lighter (more aluminium)? They could then use a turbo charged "multi-air" type powerplant with a smaller displacement, maybe 1.6 or 1.7 litres.
A 2600 lbs 225 hp car would still be fun and quick.
A 2600 lbs 225 hp car would still be fun and quick.
porsche electric race car, maybe this for mitsu???
"hybrid technology in road-going sports cars.
The mechanical hybrid technology in the car has been developed especially for racing, and is significantly different in its configuration and components from conventional hybrid systems.
The electrical front axle drive with two electric motors developing 60 kW each supplements the 480-bhp four-litre flat-six at the rear of the 911 GT3 R Hybrid.
Instead of the usual batteries in a hybrid road car, an electrical flywheel power generator is fitted in the interior next to the driver and delivers energy to the electric motors.
The flywheel generator itself is an electric motor with its rotor spinning at up to 40,000 rpm, storing energy mechanically. The flywheel generator is charged whenever the driver applies the brakes, with the two electric motors reversing their function on the front axle and acting themselves as generators.
When accelerating out of a bend or when overtaking, the driver is able to call up extra energy from the charged flywheel generator, the flywheel being slowed down electromagnetically in the generator mode and thus supplying up to 120 kW to the two electric motors at the front from its kinetic energy. This additional power is available to the driver after each charge process for approximately 6 - 8 seconds.
This means that the energy formerly converted into heat upon every application of the brakes, is now converted into additional drive power."
"hybrid technology in road-going sports cars.
The mechanical hybrid technology in the car has been developed especially for racing, and is significantly different in its configuration and components from conventional hybrid systems.
The electrical front axle drive with two electric motors developing 60 kW each supplements the 480-bhp four-litre flat-six at the rear of the 911 GT3 R Hybrid.
Instead of the usual batteries in a hybrid road car, an electrical flywheel power generator is fitted in the interior next to the driver and delivers energy to the electric motors.
The flywheel generator itself is an electric motor with its rotor spinning at up to 40,000 rpm, storing energy mechanically. The flywheel generator is charged whenever the driver applies the brakes, with the two electric motors reversing their function on the front axle and acting themselves as generators.
When accelerating out of a bend or when overtaking, the driver is able to call up extra energy from the charged flywheel generator, the flywheel being slowed down electromagnetically in the generator mode and thus supplying up to 120 kW to the two electric motors at the front from its kinetic energy. This additional power is available to the driver after each charge process for approximately 6 - 8 seconds.
This means that the energy formerly converted into heat upon every application of the brakes, is now converted into additional drive power."
Evolved Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,815
Likes: 24
From: Davidson, NC
porsche electric race car, maybe this for mitsu???
"hybrid technology in road-going sports cars.
The mechanical hybrid technology in the car has been developed especially for racing, and is significantly different in its configuration and components from conventional hybrid systems.
The electrical front axle drive with two electric motors developing 60 kW each supplements the 480-bhp four-litre flat-six at the rear of the 911 GT3 R Hybrid.
Instead of the usual batteries in a hybrid road car, an electrical flywheel power generator is fitted in the interior next to the driver and delivers energy to the electric motors.
The flywheel generator itself is an electric motor with its rotor spinning at up to 40,000 rpm, storing energy mechanically. The flywheel generator is charged whenever the driver applies the brakes, with the two electric motors reversing their function on the front axle and acting themselves as generators.
When accelerating out of a bend or when overtaking, the driver is able to call up extra energy from the charged flywheel generator, the flywheel being slowed down electromagnetically in the generator mode and thus supplying up to 120 kW to the two electric motors at the front from its kinetic energy. This additional power is available to the driver after each charge process for approximately 6 - 8 seconds.
This means that the energy formerly converted into heat upon every application of the brakes, is now converted into additional drive power."
"hybrid technology in road-going sports cars.
The mechanical hybrid technology in the car has been developed especially for racing, and is significantly different in its configuration and components from conventional hybrid systems.
The electrical front axle drive with two electric motors developing 60 kW each supplements the 480-bhp four-litre flat-six at the rear of the 911 GT3 R Hybrid.
Instead of the usual batteries in a hybrid road car, an electrical flywheel power generator is fitted in the interior next to the driver and delivers energy to the electric motors.
The flywheel generator itself is an electric motor with its rotor spinning at up to 40,000 rpm, storing energy mechanically. The flywheel generator is charged whenever the driver applies the brakes, with the two electric motors reversing their function on the front axle and acting themselves as generators.
When accelerating out of a bend or when overtaking, the driver is able to call up extra energy from the charged flywheel generator, the flywheel being slowed down electromagnetically in the generator mode and thus supplying up to 120 kW to the two electric motors at the front from its kinetic energy. This additional power is available to the driver after each charge process for approximately 6 - 8 seconds.
This means that the energy formerly converted into heat upon every application of the brakes, is now converted into additional drive power."
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 13
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From: St Louis, MO
Kers tech in a street car would be great, although I tend to think of it as a short boost like nitrous or an electronically controlled temporary spike in turbo PSI.... but maybe that's just b/c it was originally developed in f1... But anti-lag would be accurate if paired with a smaller motor lol
You guys won't still be *****ing if a turbodiesel/electric hybrid EVO outruns the current car, will you?
The problem is going to be, for a lot of us, how these new cars respond to mods. Gasoline turbocharged motors are easy: Add a bigger turbo, add fuel, add cams, add a tune, WHEEE! When we get into hybrid-diesel-love-powered-machines-of-glory-and-lust, we're adding a whole new layer of difficulty to tuning and performance.
Do I think it'll be POSSIBLE? Sure. But the possibility of "making it really damn hard to mod correctly" does exist. Take the SST, for example; a great transmission, but the TCU still isn't fully unlocked, and few shops really have mastered it. I like the X GSR since every shop in the world can work on my transmission, and the motor is just a 4-banger turbo; not confusing.
If we become a fully SST'd hybrid-diesel car of doom, running on diesel and with a solar panel on our roof, the learning curve is going to go up, especially for a lot of shops that don't see a massive amount of Evos.
Evolved Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 606
Likes: 14
From: Philly
They are making the evo less and less affordable with these higher end models like the MR touring. They should introduce a fully stripped besides having automatic windows RS starting at 28k. That should be the entry level evo and get rid of the MR touring and make those options on the regular MR. They should really just create a beast of a evo before this 35mpg kicks in.
Its almost like the grand finale so to speak. Keep the hp levels the same reduce weight allowing the evo to do 0-60 in 4.6-4.7 with a moderate improvement in handling capabilities. Create the option of a six speed in a lighter MR with the amenities such as the sunroof as a option. RS: 0-60:4.6 GSR & MR:4.7-4.8 to me would be the ideal evo lineup.
This is very possible and a smart move your are catering to both crowds by introducing the car in street/track standard form with the luxury amenities as an option for those who want more luxury thus a heavier evo. How they would do it is up to them maybe make the options cheaper to balance the price out or combine the options as packages I dont know. I think they need to do something performance wise cus it looks like they are heading in the wrong direction
Its almost like the grand finale so to speak. Keep the hp levels the same reduce weight allowing the evo to do 0-60 in 4.6-4.7 with a moderate improvement in handling capabilities. Create the option of a six speed in a lighter MR with the amenities such as the sunroof as a option. RS: 0-60:4.6 GSR & MR:4.7-4.8 to me would be the ideal evo lineup.
This is very possible and a smart move your are catering to both crowds by introducing the car in street/track standard form with the luxury amenities as an option for those who want more luxury thus a heavier evo. How they would do it is up to them maybe make the options cheaper to balance the price out or combine the options as packages I dont know. I think they need to do something performance wise cus it looks like they are heading in the wrong direction
Probably because it'd be stupid expensive to do that?
Not really, take a small platform 3 door like the colt 3dr, which weighs in at 2060 lbs according to Mitsubishi euro website (shorter wire harness, less weight in carpet, smaller windows, less steel/alloy used for the chassis), give it AWD, alloy doors, roof, hood and major suspension components. Lighten the glass and interior materials. I'm sure there are many areas weight could be cut.
Not really, take a small platform 3 door like the colt 3dr, which weighs in at 2060 lbs according to Mitsubishi euro website (shorter wire harness, less weight in carpet, smaller windows, less steel/alloy used for the chassis), give it AWD, alloy doors, roof, hood and major suspension components. Lighten the glass and interior materials. I'm sure there are many areas weight could be cut.
Last edited by blue4uevo8; Jun 22, 2010 at 12:32 PM.
^^^
you make it sound all too easy. its all about the cost per hp per $$ in stock form.
why is 3/4 of the responses neglecting the fact that mitsubishi is just trying to keep up with its competitors. its always about the money. note all the facts of "what it shouldve been" all it comes to play in the design process. upper management doesnt decide on fan based intuitions. they do whats right for the company's best interest. no use complaining about this small change because we still dont have legally bordered, document evo I-VI stateside. would we ever, nope. no choice fighting over something that cant be won.
you make it sound all too easy. its all about the cost per hp per $$ in stock form.
why is 3/4 of the responses neglecting the fact that mitsubishi is just trying to keep up with its competitors. its always about the money. note all the facts of "what it shouldve been" all it comes to play in the design process. upper management doesnt decide on fan based intuitions. they do whats right for the company's best interest. no use complaining about this small change because we still dont have legally bordered, document evo I-VI stateside. would we ever, nope. no choice fighting over something that cant be won.
Well, yes and no. I don't doubt the new Evo XI will be faster than a stock Evo X; from generation to generation they do typically get "Better".
The problem is going to be, for a lot of us, how these new cars respond to mods. Gasoline turbocharged motors are easy: Add a bigger turbo, add fuel, add cams, add a tune, WHEEE! When we get into hybrid-diesel-love-powered-machines-of-glory-and-lust, we're adding a whole new layer of difficulty to tuning and performance.
Do I think it'll be POSSIBLE? Sure. But the possibility of "making it really damn hard to mod correctly" does exist. Take the SST, for example; a great transmission, but the TCU still isn't fully unlocked, and few shops really have mastered it. I like the X GSR since every shop in the world can work on my transmission, and the motor is just a 4-banger turbo; not confusing.
If we become a fully SST'd hybrid-diesel car of doom, running on diesel and with a solar panel on our roof, the learning curve is going to go up, especially for a lot of shops that don't see a massive amount of Evos.
The problem is going to be, for a lot of us, how these new cars respond to mods. Gasoline turbocharged motors are easy: Add a bigger turbo, add fuel, add cams, add a tune, WHEEE! When we get into hybrid-diesel-love-powered-machines-of-glory-and-lust, we're adding a whole new layer of difficulty to tuning and performance.
Do I think it'll be POSSIBLE? Sure. But the possibility of "making it really damn hard to mod correctly" does exist. Take the SST, for example; a great transmission, but the TCU still isn't fully unlocked, and few shops really have mastered it. I like the X GSR since every shop in the world can work on my transmission, and the motor is just a 4-banger turbo; not confusing.
If we become a fully SST'd hybrid-diesel car of doom, running on diesel and with a solar panel on our roof, the learning curve is going to go up, especially for a lot of shops that don't see a massive amount of Evos.
What I am worried about is the added complexity of modding and working on the cars just like you said. With electric batteries and electric motors, and presumably some separate control unit, you're adding undue stress to your life and possibly your wallet if you suffer from the the mod bug.
Do I think they can make the next evo perform well in stock form? Of course. Evo's were never the fastest thing on the road but they handle like dreams and had the potential to increase power almost effortlessly. I've taken my fat pig of an X around an on ramp at 75 mph with two other people in the car. The fact that
a) i even thought about doing it,
b) it actual held its grip and composure, and
c) we made it safely out the other side with mimimum tire squeal and gigantic smiles on our faces,
speaks volumes about the chassis, the s-awc, and the technology in general. In addition to that, adding simple bolt ons like intakes and turbo back exhausts uncork these things like crazy. Adding a tune extracts even more. Taking the turbo out of the equation (as the motortrend article suggests), or adding electric motors and batteries, or adding a diesel engine, or a combination of those things, is straying away from a formula that simple gearheads likes us might not feel like tackling.
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Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Orange County