Yes, I realize that the Ricardo is a dual wet clutch, which apparently is capable of more torque because of heat and wear on the clutches, but I seem to recall someone making a statement that it was going to be a dry dual clutch, where I don't know. I looked at all of the MMC info that I could muster up, yet I could not find the source of my own quote. I have since started looking into comapanies not related to MMC in any way. So far I have look at ZF Sachs, Luk, and Valeo which all have dual dry clutch development. I did some research at the www.zeroshift.com website. It seems that they are pretty tight lipped about there technology as far as who is going to use it first. It's so simple that it seems too easy to work and can be fitted to any transmission, makes the transmission lighter, and shows less wear then any other transmission on the market. So until I can find more pertanent(sp?) information I'm out.

 

I heard that before but I don't really think these article hold much weight. The production version it still too far away to tell.

 

Made some color changes using the Geneva pics
candyapple

 

black

 

blue

 

orange

 

You honestly think Subaru isn't going to follow suit?

You "old skoolers" can fight it all you want, but the stickshift has run it's course. Letting off the gas to accelerate is not exactly ideal.

The DSG is relatively new technology, and it's already outperforming the old, tried-and-true stick. Imagine what they'll be doing 5-10 years from now.

 

I recall reading about the Zeroshift concept in a recent issue of Sport Compact Car. Pretty interesting concept.

 

Good thread, and good posts with information. I'm going to give more of a consumer's point of view with a bit of transmission ideas at the side.

Let me start by saying I'm a motorcycle rider, both dirt and street. Having owned a handful of bikes, I think automobiles with manual trannies have been mandated into two clunky areas: 1.) H-pattern shifting and 2.) large single plate clutches.

My question then kind of rolls around why do we keep both religiously, and why does any new solution have to be so complicated, even towards a dual clutch?

The H-pattern I believe has always been used because its pretty easy to manufacture, and allows a user to go find any gear ratio at any time, in any situation. In fact in the olden golden days, you'll find some autos where one must move individual levers for each gear ratio. Even the H-pattern shifter was an upgrade towards that.

Motorcycles, because we can't make our feet do intricate patterns, have only an up / down lever. Under proper training and practise, the user can shift without using the clutch to disengage power from the transmission. The rider releases power momentarily by releasing the throttle to momentarily disengage power from the transmission. The gear selection actuator (i.e. lever) is built with such precision, it gets the transmission to the next gear, within the mechanical characteristic of the motor to come 'back' on power and get the bike accelerating again.

Can you still use the clutch? Yes. Is the transmission built fundamentally different? No. The improvement in technology for a motorcycle tranny is a device (usually a rotating barrel) that mimmics the sequential nature of a regular manual H-pattern tranny. If I were given a car today (EVO) with a lever to my right that provided the same function as motorcycle type shifting, and still had to use a clutch, I'd have absolutely no problem making the transition.

Speaking to the clutch mechanism, and again coming from the motorcycle background, its amazing to see that multiplate designs basically shrink the diameter of the motor / transmission housing, and can be placed in an area to reduce the clutch servicing cost; but, companies that build the public's cars, STILL have not incorporated multiplate designs. By shrinking the "bell housing" mate (if even needed) designers could place the motor closer to the ground, providing a wealth of benefits by lowering the motor's CG. I also believe that multiplate clutches favor more easily produced and better disengage mechansims, so that if the clutching actuation were to be automated, it would be much easier on a multiplate, small diameter design.

Some may claim that a flywheel is necessary for some energy storage applications (i.e. easier off-the-line) but I contest that there are mechanisms already in place, better than a huge spinning mass to get somebody started off of the line. Some of those would be better car handling education, and sensor compensated maneuvers.

My solution right now for a really slick EVO X tranny? Sequential lever actuated shifting mechanism where the current H-pattern shifter is WITH clutch. It believe its a nice KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) solution many EVO enthusiasts would enjoy.

~j.

 

Zeroshift hasn't gone anywhere in 3 years, I don't think it will ever go into production either. There is no real market for a no-clutch transmission, DSG is much more palatable for the consumer.

 

that is true they most likely will. i mistyped and what i wanted to say is that i'll buy a car with a traditional manual. I said subaru because if i weren't to own an evo I would go with an sti (although i would hate to considering with my experience the evo is more fun to drive)

 

This color was tricky but after looking at the results i think i'm going to buy a white evo X! Does someone have a higher res image to work with?

 

...not why I got the EVO. Not everyone buys it to mod the hell out of it. I bought one because it is a great package as is. I'd like to see some actual statistics on who mods vs. who doesn't. Your speculation means jack...

The EVO X looks like it's shaping up to be a great package. Hopefully Mitsubishi will use it as a rally platform if they jump back in to WRC. I'll consider buying one at that point.


Cabo

 

Nice job on the colors. I had to use some cheap software with a red-eye removal tool to get a color close to black...lol I don't have Photoshop installed on my computer anymore.

The highest resolution pics I've seen are at this site: http://www.lancerregister.com/art_conceptx.php#/

Unless somebody has some really hi-res pix from the auto shows or something. Anybody have any?

 

Here's one that will REALLY get under the skin of some of you guys: CVT transmissions will ultimately make all others obsolete.

They will hold the RPM at the perfect point of power production and economy. No more shifting...manually or otherwise.