One more 16g thread - few questions
I'd like to post the latest in my tuning saga. First....it runs like a champ. The Speed Density 2.0 ROM by all parties leading up to it, and Roadspike who iced the cake, is running well.
Here was my biggest issue. First, I battled with the concept of load, and how much I wanted to see...and then I came to terms with "it's not how much load you run, it's how well it runs". So, on the evo MAF I was used to seeing 155 load, but on SD, I see 130, so as long as my timing map matches that, it's all gravy.
Second issue, accel enrichment...what a pain. The settings for an evo are way off. I took all the settings i could from the base lancer, and then added tables for the stuff i couldn't find to the base rom using Roadspikes auto SD rom for base lancers, stealing from the XML file, and then dumped async accel vs tps delta, vs rpm, vs coolant temp, engine temp....just all of that, into the EVO rom, and it really does work just perfectly. I kept fighting with it for the longest time, trying to tune it myself, but it seemed like everything was "3 steps forward, 2 steps back" since a lot of those tables aren't self explanatory. The approach of just using what was proven already was much smarter.
So, tonight I did one more pull in 3rd at WOT, and I'd like some opinions on what to do next. Boost is shown in the dyno log, and it does not kick up and stay, it gradually comes on which isn't necessarily ideal. Also, give me your thoughts on AFR's, and what you think I should be at vs where I am. Lastly, tell me where you think I should increase/decrease timing next to make more power, and obviously to eliminate knock.
Here was my biggest issue. First, I battled with the concept of load, and how much I wanted to see...and then I came to terms with "it's not how much load you run, it's how well it runs". So, on the evo MAF I was used to seeing 155 load, but on SD, I see 130, so as long as my timing map matches that, it's all gravy.
Second issue, accel enrichment...what a pain. The settings for an evo are way off. I took all the settings i could from the base lancer, and then added tables for the stuff i couldn't find to the base rom using Roadspikes auto SD rom for base lancers, stealing from the XML file, and then dumped async accel vs tps delta, vs rpm, vs coolant temp, engine temp....just all of that, into the EVO rom, and it really does work just perfectly. I kept fighting with it for the longest time, trying to tune it myself, but it seemed like everything was "3 steps forward, 2 steps back" since a lot of those tables aren't self explanatory. The approach of just using what was proven already was much smarter.
So, tonight I did one more pull in 3rd at WOT, and I'd like some opinions on what to do next. Boost is shown in the dyno log, and it does not kick up and stay, it gradually comes on which isn't necessarily ideal. Also, give me your thoughts on AFR's, and what you think I should be at vs where I am. Lastly, tell me where you think I should increase/decrease timing next to make more power, and obviously to eliminate knock.
Looks pretty good need to fix that boost issue and your car will feel loads better.
As a tip when the turbo is trying to spool up drop the AFR into the low 11's to high 10's and decrease timing just a little bit. This will put more energy into the exhaust and create better spool up. The timing in this area will look pretty flat as the boost increases you want to increase the effeciency of the motor and so timing will remain nearly the same as boost pressure rises with a slight downward trend.
This will make EGT's look really hot so you need to balance this approach into an area of load where you really are going WOT not just partial throttle.
Your boost may be bouncing around due to a loose wastegate arm. It seems like its just flapping in the wind so to speak since the boost don't "come on" so to speak and stay there. The behavior it shows seems like the arm could be pulled open very easily since boost comes up with rpm.
As a tip when the turbo is trying to spool up drop the AFR into the low 11's to high 10's and decrease timing just a little bit. This will put more energy into the exhaust and create better spool up. The timing in this area will look pretty flat as the boost increases you want to increase the effeciency of the motor and so timing will remain nearly the same as boost pressure rises with a slight downward trend.
This will make EGT's look really hot so you need to balance this approach into an area of load where you really are going WOT not just partial throttle.
Your boost may be bouncing around due to a loose wastegate arm. It seems like its just flapping in the wind so to speak since the boost don't "come on" so to speak and stay there. The behavior it shows seems like the arm could be pulled open very easily since boost comes up with rpm.
Compare this graph to the previous. I added about 1.5mm of preload, or 3 spins. I couldn't just push the rod onto the wastegate thing, so that's better for sure. My concern is I expect to spike at lower load, and then dip some up top....but maybe that's just evos, I dunno. The turbo is/was used, so that sneaking suspicion that it may be bad or something is there. Oh, and I'll like a little video here shortly too, of me just farting around with the bov.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVEj0...e_gdata_player
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVEj0...e_gdata_player
Last edited by HornstarBU; Jul 15, 2011 at 10:40 PM.
9 bov, JUST VENTING INSTEAD of recirc. I may get a diff one that is adjustable. Tial is what roadspikesays to get. I like stuff that doesn't require a flange change. Like rfl xs, or typeS, or forge that looks like Tial. Any recommendations? I known don't needs new one, but itdoes open a hairtoo slow and has a quick momentof flutter. Worse at low load btw.
Latest Dyno graph, this is 1 spin tighter on the WGA eyelet. It looks to hold boost pretty solid, still a small dip though.
Also, please suggest anything you can. I knock like crazy on shifting. I think it has to do with moving to SD2.0, but what specificially it is, I am not sure. My timing/load drop down in the low load high timing range when I let of the gas almost instantly, maybe that has to do with it I am assuming. Like, WOT, vrrrrrmmmmm, shift (timing goes to 34 at 10 load), vrrrrmmmm timing is at -9 because I just got 20 counts of knock on shift. How would ya fix that? I attached a log of a 1-3 gear run.
Also, please suggest anything you can. I knock like crazy on shifting. I think it has to do with moving to SD2.0, but what specificially it is, I am not sure. My timing/load drop down in the low load high timing range when I let of the gas almost instantly, maybe that has to do with it I am assuming. Like, WOT, vrrrrrmmmmm, shift (timing goes to 34 at 10 load), vrrrrmmmm timing is at -9 because I just got 20 counts of knock on shift. How would ya fix that? I attached a log of a 1-3 gear run.
Last edited by HornstarBU; Jul 16, 2011 at 07:12 PM.
First thing I am trying is swapping my accel enrichment settings around a littler, to see if maybe my injectors are squirting too much and causing it. Is that possible? Could also be like, TOB or the bov even maybe? Meh, maybe not...If I just run up the RPM range, and then just let off, there isn't any knock. It's only when I punch it again, as you say....grrr, gotta figure it out so those minivans won't stand a chance.
I've seriously been considering getting a TIAL, but I don't know that it'll fix the issue. I want to make sure it all runs perfectly before I start doing "additional" stuff. So, it could be comp surge or flutter if it's only when I switch to the next gear? I thought that maybe it was not that, or the bov, since it doesn't register knock unless I push the next gear. Maybe I'm overthinking this. I did setup my stock 9 bov to vta, now that i'm vta. reason was 2 fold, 1...because i wanted to see if it worked. 2...because the recirc hose i was using isn't really fitting in wellsince i had to swivel the uicp and it needs to be longer, so i mean i can go back to recirc if i need to, just need a new hose.
No, I didnt mean the compressor surge or wastegate flutter was causing the knock.
It was just something I noticed in the video that you may want to look at
You can try to use higher octane fuel to test if its phantom knock,
or use some detonation cans
It was just something I noticed in the video that you may want to look at
You can try to use higher octane fuel to test if its phantom knock,
or use some detonation cans
+1 I have the same issue, its jus crazy. I thought the problem could be when it goes into boost to quick the afrs are not below 12.5 but that was just my theory. Not sure on how to fix that but I wait the same amount of time as 03lance
I am pretty sure the answer is spot on with the threads I have read in the evo section and Hornstar mentioned about the timing going sky high for a split second while you shift since the load drops instantly. I just dont follow how exactly they went about fixing it. To be honest I didnt really try too hard either though since at the time I was heavy into getting my tune as a whole better so I had bigger things to worry about and now I am just getting lazy :-). Well that and my laptop power cord is toast and havent bought another yet...