When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
The Loft / EvoM Car Talk CornerThe landing pad for automotive discussions, news, articles, and opinions. A place for the community to kick back and chat.
Guess I wasn't the only one.................. I'm pushing reality, you are ignoring it.
With all due repect, Your version of "reality" is skewed. You claim an equal comparison when you are including the variables others have mentioned (options, location, the mood of the dealership manager). We're using empirical data to compare, you are using theoretical. MSRP vs MSRP compares the cars fairly. Otherwise, why not test one car at 0-60mph uphill, the other downhill, and compare. Sure, they both start out at the same 0-60, but now we have options.
Or, we could all be wrong and you are the right one. Which seems more likely, though?
And the resulting comparison from his "reality" is further skewed. You're comparing a bone stock car, with full warranty, to a brand new car with $8,000 in aftermarket parts dumped into it and no warranty. It's not a reasonable comparison.
You're pushing anecdotal evidence as "reality". The fact is that MSRP on the two cars is very close. The fact that some RS are being above MSRP and some Evos are being sold below MSRP does not open the door to a comparison between the most expensive RS you can find, and the cheapest Evo you can find, which includes thousands in extra mods.
I was giving you the cheapest RS which is the base sticker of 36/37. I can't find any for that price, but I assume someone is getting one somehwere.
Here is edmunds true market price.............. still 6 grand cheaper.
Truecar claims an average of 4371 off sticker price for 2015 EVO. Can't even get RS to come up on truecar, probably because no one gets any discount (or there are none for sale in my area, and truecar is tied heavily to dealer inventory).
This is the cheapest ford dealers on the east coast, Koons, they currently have 2936 fords between 3 dealers (heck, they have 8 shelby's and even a GT350R). I got 6 grand off my 14 GT and over 7 grand off my 15 fusion. They have 9 RS's, cheapest one over 40 @ STICKER.
You can not compare a modded car to a stock one, I don't care what the price points are. If you want to make that comparison, I can buy a C5 Z06 and set it up to kill a stock RS or your modded Evo X in any racing venue. But that's just dumb.
Ford is not responsible for the aftermarket coming in and making badass go fast parts.
Also, when you modify a vehicle, you throw the longevity factor out the window. Which is something that OEM engineers have to follow. Same thing with emissions, NVH, ride quality, and several other factors that go into building a new car. It is simply an unfair, and unreasonable, comparison to say one car is better because I can buy for it less and modify it to better than the more expensive car.
I noticed the figure 8 time of 24.0. I think the number for an Evolution X MR was 24.5? But, I guess the Ford Focus RS has better tires....how much of that 0.5 second difference could the Cup 2 tires account for, all else equal?
Any way, when he was discussing the Race Mode issues we come to the interesting part (in light of our recent "discussion") here:
"...This is truly disappointing because the Focus RS’ fundamentals are solid: from chassis to steering response, you feel an unyielding sense of terrific agility. Eliminate the pogo-stick bounce, and the Focus RS will reframe your perception of previous all-wheel-drive sport compacts, such as the Subaru WRX STI and Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution. It’s much, much faster and more fun to drive.
The biggest problem becomes price. From a pure performance standpoint, the Focus RS gets uncomfortably close to better driving rear-drive coupes that are faster and capable of real honest-to-goodness drifts without the need of special modes. With a base price of $36,775, the Focus RS equals that of a Mustang GT with the optional Performance pack and Recaro bucket seats. When loaded with options, the Focus RS gets close in price to the vastly superior-handling and faster Chevrolet Camaro SS 1LE. The hatchback and four doors make the car more livable for a single-car family, but there are better-performing and better-riding cars available for $42,245..."
Hard to **** with a 1LE
____________________________________________
Some miscellaneous RS findings and comparisons from another guy mentioned earlier in this thread: https://theramseyedrivingblog.blogspot.ca/
Last edited by moparfan; Nov 24, 2016 at 08:51 AM.
You can not compare a modded car to a stock one, I don't care what the price points are. If you want to make that comparison, I can buy a C5 Z06 and set it up to kill a stock RS or your modded Evo X in any racing venue. But that's just dumb.
Ford is not responsible for the aftermarket coming in and making badass go fast parts.
Also, when you modify a vehicle, you throw the longevity factor out the window. Which is something that OEM engineers have to follow. Same thing with emissions, NVH, ride quality, and several other factors that go into building a new car. It is simply an unfair, and unreasonable, comparison to say one car is better because I can buy for it less and modify it to better than the more expensive car.
Well, you don't have to believe this comparison is reasonable or fair. The rest of the world does. Millions buy a cheaper NEW car and mod it with bolt ons to be better (in their eyes) than a more expensive car.
The public speaks with it's buying habits and pocket book all the time. Your only discussion point left is a more expensive car is better than a cheaper car. We all knew that was generally true before this message board, or even the internet (or even cars themselves) existed.
And any racing venue, how about ice??? oops, maybe not..............
Well, you don't have to believe this comparison is reasonable or fair. The rest of the world does. Millions buy a cheaper NEW car and mod it with bolt ons to be better (in their eyes) than a more expensive car.
The public speaks with it's buying habits and pocket book all the time. Your only discussion point left is a more expensive car is better than a cheaper car. We all knew that was generally true before this message board, or even the internet (or even cars themselves) existed.
And any racing venue, how about ice??? oops, maybe not..............
Nevermind, no point in wasting any more time trying to convince you what every car shopper does, every time they comparison shop for a new car. I'm sure they only look at MSRP and call it a day................
Nevermind, no point in wasting any more time trying to convince you what every car shopper does, every time they comparison shop for a new car. I'm sure they only look at MSRP and call it a day................
Not every car shopper has plans to modify the brand new car they are considering purchasing. People who modify their cars are actually a small minority.
Not every car shopper will buy an RS at the rates you have claimed. That's the whole issue here; you want to use the above MSRP prices for the RS, while also using below MSRP prices for the Evo.
enthusiast does lol , and who ever going to get into an argument about cars / buying cars made for specially the Enthusiast market like the RS or the STI / Evo etc or on some car related forum , they most likely do then not.
anyhow, I am watching right now the WTCC race in Eurosport, and the safety car is a white evo 9
